file Kestrelle Hayes and multiple targets

26 May 2015 11:17 #71325 by Whisker
What happens when Kestrelle Hayes or any other vampire that has stealth bonus against specific target makes D action against multiple players (e.g. border skirmish) where some of the targets meet the criteria for stealth bonus and others don't?

a) The action has individual stealth score against each target.
b) The criteria for stealth special is met, and bonus is gained against all targets.
c) No bonus is gained.
d) something weird (please specify)

I would argue for option b), but I'm not quite certain.


Kestrelle Hayes
[dom]
[for]
[obt]
[AUS]

[Ventrue antitribu] Ventrue antitribu

Capacity: 6

Group: 5

Sabbat. Black Hand: Kestrelle gets +1 stealth on (D) actions directed at a Methuselah who doesn't control a ready Sabbat vampire.

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26 May 2015 12:22 #71326 by Ankha

What happens when Kestrelle Hayes or any other vampire that has stealth bonus against specific target makes D action against multiple players (e.g. border skirmish) where some of the targets meet the criteria for stealth bonus and others don't?

a) The action has individual stealth score against each target.
b) The criteria for stealth special is met, and bonus is gained against all targets.
c) No bonus is gained.
d) something weird (please specify)

I'd say she doesn't get the bonus, since all the targets don't meet the criteria.

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director

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26 May 2015 13:39 #71327 by Borrelstein
For the example Border Skirmish:

+1 stealth action. Requires a ready anarch.
(D) Each other Methuselah discards one card at random from his or her hand, and this anarch untaps at the end of the turn.

I think it does fulfill the criteria depending on the target. It is directed at each methuselah, and as stealth is related to blocking and each methuselah gets an individual chance to try to block, it makes sense that people without a sabbat vampire have more trouble in blocking the action, hence in this case I would say it is option a). JUDGE! :woohoo:

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26 May 2015 14:41 #71330 by jamesatzephyr

I think it does fulfill the criteria depending on the target. It is directed at each methuselah, and as stealth is related to blocking and each methuselah gets an individual chance to try to block, it makes sense that people without a sabbat vampire have more trouble in blocking the action, hence in this case I would say it is option a). JUDGE! :woohoo:


No, stealth is just one value that goes up or down, you don't track stealth differently for each Methuselah on the table.

The only real choices here are whether:

- you need every target Methuselah to not have a Sabbat vampire for the special ability to apply
- any single target Methuselah not having a Sabbat vampire would activate the ability.

Based on her wording, I'd go for the latter - a multi-target (D) action by Andy that targets Brenda (controls Gratiano, Sabbat) and Charlie (controls Anneke, Camarilla) is directed at "a Methuselah who doesn't control a ready Sabbat vampire", because Charlie is one of those.

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26 May 2015 17:04 - 26 May 2015 17:08 #71334 by TwoRazorReign
You wrote: "No, stealth is just one value that goes up or down, you don't track stealth differently for each Methuselah on the table."

Why not? Is there a ruling or something else your assertion is based on? It's a D action targeting multiple Methuselahs. If the targeted Methuselah does not control a ready sabbat vampire, the criteria to gain stealth against that Methuselah is met. This seems logical. But I wonder if there is a ruling that counteracts this logic.
Last edit: 26 May 2015 17:08 by TwoRazorReign.

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26 May 2015 17:18 #71335 by N1CK3Y
I am a newbie, here, but my understanding on this is that there is but ONE action directed at several methuselahs, rather than each having the occasion of blocking different instances of the very same action. One very much same action can not be at 0 stealth and at 1 stealth at the same time, it just doesn't make any sense. Either the action is at 0 stealth for everybody, either it is at 1. This is a card game, not quantum physics.

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