A new direction for Tremere gameplay

This is not a pet i am thinking you mis-read or skimmed through the post ? what you do is use a master card to equip a relic (equipment unique to Tremere) and then use other master cards to enhance or give stats to that equipment. for your vampires not minions.

The idea is that you have a base relic that you begin with and you add stats to it, giving the vampire with it base abilities, the options with this are endless i could point out many ideas but i realize the balance team would choose them in the end. Your choices of stats depend on what other players are doing. They will not know how you choose to enhance the relic you have.

This mechanism for (V:tes) Tremere gives the clan an option to focus on equipment which is something most decks have as an option rather then a main strength.

MrMagika wrote:

The idea is that you have a base relic that you begin with and you add stats to it, giving the vampire with it base abilities, the options with this are endless i could point out many ideas but i realize the balance team would choose them in the end. Your choices of stats depend on what other players are doing. They will not know how you choose to enhance the relic you have.

This mechanism for (V:tes) Tremere gives the clan an option to focus on equipment which is something most decks have as an option rather then a main strength.

Eh... kind of like seal of Veddartha?

Mmmmhhh... I have some issues here..

- Power level wise, this sort of direction seems dangerous, since Tremere already have pretty much the best way to tutor an equipment out of the deck ( Magic of the smith , which is super good).

- Tremere also have the highest potential to abuse such cards due to Ankara citadel already going along perfectly with magic of the smith.. Ie. blood/pool costs as a balancing device wouldn't work terribly well with these cards.

- Lorewise, I think Tremere should focus on spells/rituals with magical relics as secondary. I had an idea of action cards that would be put into play for few turns("rituals"), and would do some kind of stuff while there (kind of like Under siege).

- (EDIT) Lorewise there is another problem with using master cards as 'fuel' for these equipments. Master cards represent the player him/herself as a methuselah, an ancient vampire. Master cards aren't so much the domain of Tremere clan (or any particular clan for that matter). Therefore the player giving master cards to these vampires to use wouldn't really symbolize stuff that tremere clan itself normally does, rather it would symbolize the tremere vampires being 'helped' by the player. This idea doesn't sit well with me because of this.

- (EDIT) As others pointed out, there is another problem with involving master cards: they are pretty much the strongest cards in the game (thus they are normally limited to being played only once per turn). In other words, master card slots in a deck are extremely contested. You can't just stuff random master cards to the deck for these equipments. It would quite possibly create a mechanic that doesn't interest any deckbuilder, ie. be underused. Or at the very least be very difficult to balance.

While there could be 1-2 equipment like this introduced, designers have to tread on dangerous ground due to abovementioned cards. I don't know if you were unaware of above cards, or if you severely underestimate them. But from a game designers standpoint Tremere are pretty much the worst pick for a clan to use some kind of equipment...

Bloodartist wrote:

ps. I'm totally perplexed why the first reaction of old players to any suggestions for new stuff tends to be "NO!!!!!!". Every thriving CCG or LCG in existence understands the value of continually introducing new exciting stuff.

Yeah, okay, I guess that's fair. People might be coming off as a bit strong in here, and in these cases.

It might be that suggesting some actual cards to open up discussion could inspire a bit more thought-out answers, and even a bit more positivity. Dunno. For the past summer there's been a lot of new card suggestions, most of which are excellently thought-out, lean heavily on WoD lore and spark plenty of discussion. I wouldn't mind getting many of those cards out into play testing.

No offense to anyone, seriously (and here comes the 'but'), BUT: there's so much fandom for Tremere and asking for new things and more cool stuff for the vampwizards that you kind of get used to them. And when you do, it's often easy to come up with a routine answer: there's already more love for the Tremere than for any other clan in the game.

It does have a routinely negative tone, I know. Not exactly called for, but could be backed up. The game in itself would benefit from some new stuff for other clans THAN Tremere.

But seriously though, I doubt anyone would be against a new tech for Tremere if someone comes up with actual examples of what kinds of cards they'd be. Go for it, OP! It's easier to discuss actual examples than vague ideas.

Most of what needs to be said has come up just adding one point:

Krauss wrote:

- Gargoyles. I mean come on. Gargoyles. You don't get a more specifically tailored theme than that.

Trying to make a Gragoyle / Tremere or !Tremere deck without Tupdogs or Create Gargoyle + Dominate is ridiculously infuriating. Also the only gargoyles that are beginner friendly gameplay wise cheap enough to be expandable are Tupdogs that are in no way cheap enough monetarily to be beginner friendly. Create gargoyle is beginner wise bit pool + blood costly and usually gains most when Dominate which itself is bit sad as playing experience. Having a decent crypt Tremere or !Tremere + Gargoyles is nighmare given gargoyle's group distribution and also needing to be slave to the right clan or non-slave.

In a way both Tremeres are odd mix off extreme beginner friendliness and extreme beginner hate and could use some work still I say, but aren't the priority. Making other gargoyles than Tupdog practical to use would still be lovely.

BenPeal wrote:

Recently, there's a new factor - the upcoming 5th Edition of Vampire: the Masquerade. That will be out sometime in 2018 and I think it would be ideal to have a new Camarilla set for V:TES that coincides with the launch of V5.

This sure sounds like a solid plan!