file Vampire reboot more likely than new sets?

10 Nov 2015 14:36 - 10 Nov 2015 14:37 #74204 by pivokrevnik

Ashur wrote: Constructive would be to construct a game, a complete, great game that is better than VTES. Post it here.


no need for such demagogy.

Ashur wrote: Have you tried buying cards on Ebay recently? I feel that even not really great rares are sold for 1-2 euro. That´s pretty weird.


as I said, eBay is pretty weird as a whole. I have no answer for this, only that I would be very cautious taking it as a proof of popularity. There are collectors buying weird shit for big money all the time.

Ashur wrote: Maybe we should not judge the world by your meta?


I have no reason to believe my meta is any different than any other meta around the world. Maybe except Brazil, according to rumors?
If there is still a large potential playbase, they surely try hard to hide as much as possible. Where are they, why there are so little players on this site, on Lackey, why are tournaments in TWDA few, far between and with attendance of 10-12 players average?
I understand the concept of Masquerade :) but anyway.

Ashur wrote: every single person I´ve explayed it to has instantly understood it´s charm.


I suspect this is an overstatement, but hey, good for you, you are probably much better at explaining than I am.

Ashur wrote: Hell, lots and lots of people play complex games like Twilight Struggle ( boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/12333/twilight-struggle ) with no problem.


This. Its very fitting you mention this.
By chance, I play Twilight Struggle as well. And I think it's everything VTES is not. It's very easy to learn (but hard to master). It requires only two players to play. Even though game is also long, its not that hard to write down game state, put back into box and resume later.
And even though there are also some rulings and explanations needed, rules are very streamlined and clear cut compared to most "adult" board games.

Its a typical example of difference between a game being sophisticated and just complicated and convoluted. Chess is simple, yet much more sophisticated than, say, wargames with hundreds of different counters, cards, mechanics etc. Simplier does not equal "stupid Pokemon version". Having to remember 50 different superfluous mechanics does not equal some highly intellectual gaming experience per se.


Anyway, lets agree to disagree.
If you are right, good for you, good for me. I'd love playing existing VTES. I'd love playing a new game more.
All I can say, I will not hold my breath, that is for sure.
Last edit: 10 Nov 2015 14:37 by pivokrevnik.

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10 Nov 2015 14:53 #74205 by ReverendRevolver
If the vekn sets were physical cards, or if sealed product hadn't stopped existing in local shops, my local meta wouldn't have evaporated. In 2010/2011 we had CRAZY amounts of turnout for votes in Newark OH. 5+ tournaments a month sometimes. For at least a whole summer we averaged 3-5 tables each Friday. Since vtes takes so long, fnm tourneys showed up at the shop while we were playing, had to use extra tables to play MTG, and were done before we left each night. A few MTG players started playing vtes before and after MTG.

All the die hards kept playing, but we got back from new Orleans and confirmed the news and everything dwindled to 1-2 tables every Friday, then eventually to that every other week. People couldn't impulse buy packs, couldn't buy right then and there their own cards when they saw us playing, and the boom went bust when the cards stopped showing up and new players slowed.

Now, i have to imagine noone has the free time they once did, but there are at least as many casual vtes players who just dont play as there were before and after we had a small army of players. Thats not even columbus, which has vaguely active playgroups, thats small Newark, which has 2 hobby shops now instead of one.

Hypothesis being that players, even new ones, can always be had for a niche game. It being a real, tangible set of cards will help immensely.
Appeal lies in strategy, customization, and dynamics. Card pool (if reprinted) can be handled by "they only reprinted good stuff, the other 7000 cards aren't that important" and I believe slightly streamlining will help our learning curve.

Not that paradox can't market something else, but I've lived through easy recruiting and see most of Europe and certainly Brazil will find it easier than we will. There's an audience, and players trump all other advertisement.
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10 Nov 2015 15:42 - 10 Nov 2015 15:46 #74208 by CalibanX
I don't think it's unconstructive to acknowledge the fact that vtes has lost most of it's players over the years. Everytime I come to this forum I see threads of people trying to sell all thier cards for cheap. My own meta has dwindled to nothing and Lackey apparently has a handful of committed players keeping it going. For fans of the game like myself, i think it's very constructive to consider weather or not an entirely new reboot of the game would make more sense than simply trying to eek out a few more sets for it's die hard, but small fan base.

I think the idea of a new, greatly streamlined verison of the game is a tremendously exciting prospect to consider. A streamlined verison with the basics of what makes vtes unique is probably going to be the most profitable way to sell cards, generate enthusiasm and attract new players.

Any new, hypothetical business model for anything remotely vtes related will have to put attracting new players as it's primary focus in order to survive.
Last edit: 10 Nov 2015 15:46 by CalibanX.

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10 Nov 2015 15:59 - 10 Nov 2015 15:59 #74209 by Ashur

CalibanX wrote: I don't think it's unconstructive to acknowledge the fact that vtes has lost most of it's players over the years. Everytime I come to this forum I see threads of people trying to sell all thier cards for cheap. My own meta has dwindled to nothing and Lackey apparently has a handful of committed players keeping it going. For fans of the game like myself, i think it's very constructive to consider weather or not an entirely new reboot of the game would make more sense than simply trying to eek out a few more sets for it's die hard, but small fan base.

I think it´s wrong to draw any conclusions based on the experience of just a couple of ... fans?

"My strategy? Luck is my strategy, of course."
Last edit: 10 Nov 2015 15:59 by Ashur.

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10 Nov 2015 16:07 #74210 by cordovader
My answer to all this blablabla is clear:

The new publisher can do what it wants (continue with existing V:TES, hopefully with the VEKN expansions, reboot V:TES or do nothing at all). I will continue playing existing V:TES as long as there are players existing to play.

I will probably not play a rebooted V:TES CCG, 100% sure I'm not playing an LCG.
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10 Nov 2015 16:30 #74211 by CalibanX
I'm not arguing for my own prefrences as much as I'm trying to imagine myself in the shoes of the new owner and trying to think of what will sell. That being said, I can't imagine any vtes player today having the impression that there's a large, active fan base of current vtes players. There's a die hard group of fans who have taken heroic efforts to keep the game alive. I have nothing but gratitude for those wonderful people, but I think we're kidding ourselves if we fancy the current vtes fanbase as a the preffered market for any new vtes themed product. There's simply not enough of us for that.

In addition, it's not as if a new, rebooted vtes game would prohibt fans from playing the older version amongst themselves. WOD has been rebooted before. Why not vtes?

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