question-circle Sanctioned online tournament?

20 Aug 2018 18:53 #90150 by DJHedgehog
I was wondering if the tournament rules would allow for an online tournament?

We have plenty of players occupying the online space, and doing a 2-round + final tournament is totally in the realm of possibility. It also helps mitigate the distance a lot of players have to travel to play.

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20 Aug 2018 21:53 #90154 by jamesatzephyr

DJHedgehog wrote: I was wondering if the tournament rules would allow for an online tournament?


The main problem with doing something sanctioned is that the online environment allows for a lot of behind the scenes shenanigans that are hidden from prying eyes, such as with the ability to make deals by email or by Skype etc. (Depending on how real-time the tournament is.)

Even if there is nothing nefarious (i.e. actually illegal) going on, if this sort of communication is legit, it can make life a ton harder if a judge needs to intervene over some questions of what's going on and only some of the people on the table know that a deal has been struck. Note that illegality doesn't necessarily have to mean collusion in the strict sense, it could be something like proving to another player that you have a card in hand you say you have. Using some sort of IM with screen-sharing makes it pretty easy to do that in a way that is very tricky to forge (unlike forwarding someone an email from JOL, which could easily be forged).

It's potentially totally fine for all that to go on, assuming either people freely sign up to it and/or trust each other to honor the rules, but it may not suit everyone to have that count towards the same ratings as face-to-face tournaments.
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21 Aug 2018 10:01 #90162 by TapeTaChatte
I am not feeling that online tournaments should be sanctioned at that point, for lot of good reasons already evoked

BUT I feel, and Martin Weinmayer has started working in that direction, that we could start online tournaments with rounds + finals and prizes without sanctioning them for the moment, that's a question the next Organized Play director will have to address

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21 Aug 2018 12:42 #90163 by DJHedgehog
I'm not sure why everyone is so afraid of "secret deals" or cheating. Is this something that happens regularly in your play group? How do you deal with it in live play?

Here are the pros of an online tournament:
-no travel time
-all cards availible to all players without having to play "vtes arts and crafts"
-available to everyone who is interested (ie anyone with a computer and internet connection)

Cons:
-Someone may cheat using a chat program

People cheating is a potential problem at live tournaments, so if that's the only con you have perhaps you should reconsider your position. There are a lot of people to benefit from having online tournaments and the community as a whole has something to gain from making the game more accessible.


My thinking is that if we do the following, an online tournament could work:
-Dedicated Judge
-Ensure tournament rules include what would be considered illegal in online play
-Follow all standards for normal tournament play.

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21 Aug 2018 14:08 #90165 by beslin igor
I have already organized 5 online tournaments.
I asked for support from players who played most online at the moment.
I always demanded that the rules be respected, but I also emphasized that the tournament is online and has a friendly character.
I do not want to believe that someone cheated, but even if he was cheating, it's really difficult to make a check.
I believe that all players wanted to win, but that the main thing was the fun of playing an online tournament.
No one has ever asked that the tournament should be official.
Online is one thing,real live is another,these are two different things, and so they need to be understood on this way.
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21 Aug 2018 14:42 #90166 by DJHedgehog

beslin igor wrote: No one has ever asked that the tournament should be official.
Online is one thing,real live is another,these are two different things, and so they need to be understood on this way.


I'm asking that they should be official. I can't see a reason to not allow them to be other than people who don't like when there are changes to "their" game. Literally every time someone talks about any sort of movement or change the same few people pop up to say why it shouldn't happen.

God forbid we allow people who can't make it to a live tournament to enjoy the competitive side of the game over the internet.

"People can cheat online!"

I believe that with the current multi-judge system, it's as easy to cheat in a live game as it is online. At least online it keeps a record of all card plays and pool changes so you can literally trace everything that happens in a game.

Ask yourself these two questions and respond back here: What can online tournaments do to benefit this game? What do online tournaments do that would be a detriment to the game?
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