three "problem cards"

drnlmza wrote:

Events always effect everyone on the table. Changing Anthelios to something that decks pack to hurt ANY attempt at recursion, and that also incidently hurts already fragile Trochomancy startegies really doesn't strike me as an improvement to the game.

It hurt only master recursion thou. And hopefully, mazster are not supposed to be the main bulk of card in ash heap.

nice effort, but your nerfs are waaaaaaaay too long. Nobody will read the card text, better ban them than add clauses that makes the card impossible to understand/memorize.

why not simplify it for the same goal ?
I like the idea of counter on anthelios :
anthelios -whenever a methuselah uses anthelios ability, put a cuonter on it : its ability can't be use when there is a counter. Remove a counter during your influence phase or whenever a gehenna is played.

This way, you let other methuselah sacrifices master phase actions to limit your use of anthelios.

but even like this it's terribly long to read...


Simpler :
Whenever you use anthelios ability, returns it to your hand (discard afterwards) or shuffle it in your deck.

??

I am not so sure this is the way to go...

each card by them self is not over the top.
I think the key problem is that having MMP is what adding fuel to the fire.
You have Vampires that give MP, you have master trifle, that give you addtional MP, you have vote card that give you MP. So, I think at the heart of the problem is all together they make these cards strong.

Ashurs -- I think is fine, just add HOS clan requirement.

Anthelios -- Not sure if it need any changes, It did not really take off as a power card, only after the introduction of other MMP.

liliths -- must fetch a skill card to get your blood.

just my two cents.

Nerfing cards is never a good thing for the game.

Just create a improved sudden...

Dark Sudden Reversal
1 Pool
Cancel a master card as its played and put this card in play. No master cards can be played while this card is on play. Burn this card on the begging of the next minion phase.

Or change the wording of the current one:

Cancel a master card... bla bla bla... the current player looses all MPA.

And for anthelius... just replace the wording:

Once each master phase, a Methuselah can use a master phase action to exchange a master card in his or her hand for one in his or her ash heap. "This is treated as playing the master card in his hand."

For what it's worth and if changes need some kind of critical vote quantity - you can count my vote in favor of changing Tablets to affect only minion cards (although, everyone I've talked with said they would be quite content with them being banned) and Lilith's Blessing's change that skill cards are mandatory.

As far as Anthelios goes, if those aforementioned changes do happen, I suppose a lighter nerf is in order than op suggested. But imho, that is still quite debatable.Perhaps its effect could stay as it is but it uses up all your master phases for the turn...not sure about wording, though.

wesile wrote:

Nerfing cards is never a good thing for the game.

I hereby propose that Pulled Fang do 1 aggravated damage and not 1 damage, and inf' Majesty does not cost a blood.