On Anthelios 8. "problematic card"

This discussion is about Anthelios, the eigth problematic card and the last in this year (at least from me).

You might wonder why the heck now Anthelios? In the past days I got talked to some people who mentioned Anthelios is the reason that we have such a biased metagame towards master cards. I'm very interested what the VEKN-members participating in this forum are thinking about that matter.

So the question is as usual: Is Anthelios a problematic card for VtES?

Anthelios, The Red Star [Promo-20040411]
Cardtype: Event
Gehenna.
Once each master phase, a Methuselah can use a master phase action to exchange a master card in his or her hand for one in his or her ash heap.

Please write PRO or CON over your entry that the users can search more easily for related arguments. It's easier then to come to a opinion about this card and I'd like to have a poll again to get a clear picture of what the people here think about it.

I'm very condident that the arbitrative people will look upon our statements and take them into consideration if thinking about the design of new cards.

If you're tired of people who want to talk about cards and you want to keep the game as it is please don't be annoyed. Just state your opinion in a short sentence, in applauding a statement or just checking the right point in the poll. This is NOT to diss a card. It is about exchanging opinions and ideas.

CON.

In term of power level, it is a very powerful card that allow too much master recursion. Recursive card abuse is a problem, and Anthelios is the most powerful tool for that : recurse the most powerful card type, no clan or discipline restriction, somewhat difficult or at least specific to destroy, and work well with Parthenon and other multiple master phase action card.

In term of metagame, its very presence play down the value of Necromancy and Giovanni card by quite a bit, and it tend to slow down the game, both by the choice at every master phase and the fact that master recursion tend to autorize bloating.

Since Villein hose Minion tap no more, I strongly believe that Anthelios must be either banned or errated.

Errata proposition : once per master card per methuselah maximum ? (I.E. if you already retrived a Golconda via Anthelios you can't retrieve any Golconda). But I would better see a ban.

CON

It's just broken. Recursion of DI/Jake Washington or any other good master in situation multiple times is just too good. I understand one time recursion, but you can do it over and over for the same master. It would be way better if it would remove this master card from the game and/or all master cards in ash heap from the game.

CON

Once [Card X] is in your Ash Heap, if you have 2MPAs it might as well be in your hand. While 2MPAs is not 'common' it is not hard to get if you've got a mind to do it (Cybele, Nana Buruku, Anson, Rumors of Gehenna, Parthenon).

Anthelios, the Red Star
Event.
Gehenna.
Put this card in play. You may use a master phase action to discard a Master card from your hand and play a different master card from your ash heap (you cannot choose the card you discard). The master card you play from your ashheap is removed from the game.

CON

pretty damn broken.

like Hugh said in his interview, you can't really interact with it once it's in play. recursion is strong but most of the time there's some cost or restriction, or it's a minion action that can be blocked.

the only counter is to pack a silver bullet like Uncoiling or Fourth Cycle, and then hope the master-abuse deck isn't packing a silver bullet against THAT i.e. Not To Be (and they usually are, because they're a master deck!)

you can't practically depend on Not To Be yourself, because it's a matter of drawing it before they draw Anthelios. these decks usually have 2 copies, plus a Fortschritt Library, so the odds of them drawing it first are stacked in their favor.

Ohlmann wrote:

Since Villein hose Minion tap no more, I strongly believe that Anthelios must be either banned or errated.

Hmm. Over in the Parity Shift thread, you wrote:

"In short, Parity shift give a powerful effect, not a game-changing one. I believe that card that give powerfuls effect should be banned only if they remove completely entires decks or thousands of cards, and a quick look to vote deck don't convince me at all of that."

If we change "Parity Shift" to "Anthelios" and "vote deck" to "master recursion deck", I think you'll find that you have talked yourself out of your own point...