Stacking Biothaumaturgical Experiment

Is it possible to stack multiple experiments on the same minion at su0perior to gain multiple +1 strengths and maneuvers? Thanks

Biothaumaturgic Experiment
Cardtype: Action
Cost: 1 pool
Discipline: Thaumaturgy
+1 stealth action.
[tha] {This minion employs} an animal retainer from your hand (ignore requirements; pay cost as normal).
[THA] Put this card on a minion you control. The minion with this card gets an optional maneuver each combat and +1 strength.

Sure. No reason this couldn't be done.

thanks. thought so but some of the players were arguing about it so just wanted to make sure.

wmseith wrote:

thanks. thought so but some of the players were arguing about it so just wanted to make sure.

I'm curious. What rule did they cite for their belief that you can NOT stack cards?

Cards stack by default, because no rule says they don't.

In fact, there are cards that have text that specifically says they don't stack. Why would this text be there if cards couldn't stack in the first place?

What KevinM said.

You will save yourself a world of trouble to learn that cards stack by default instead of asking for single cards.

There are many exceptions though. Cards that are unique, Cards that can only be played once (including events), cards that can only be played once on or by a minion and so on.

But here's a list of the majority (but far from all) cards that stack.

Army of Rats (but prey only lose 1 pool regardless of how many).
Mass reality
Torn Signpost (but each card reset strength to 3 so practically nothing happens).
Masquerade Enforcement
Anarch Revolt
Brujah Debate (and the multiple cards can target a single vampire to tap).
Toreador Grand Ball (same issue, multiple cards can target a single vampire).
Spying Mission (at superior)
Phobia
Mind of a Killer
Succulent Vitae
Camarilla Exemplary
Using the Advantage
Incriminating Videotape
Flak Jacket
Cooler
Biothaumaturgic Experiment at superior.
Choir
419 Operation
Cloak the Gathering (when played by different minions).
Fatuus Mastery
Horrid Form
Eternal Vigilance (quite useless to stack)
Concert Tour (also quite useless)
The Framing (also useless)
Temptation
Infernal Familiar
Camarilla Vitae Slave
Slaughtering the Herd
Apparition
Judgment: Camarilla Segregation
Bonecraft
Disease
Mark of Damnation
Fleshcraft
Erosion
Despiral
Hexaped (the link counter stack)
Libertas
Short-Term Investment
Darksight
Atonement
Courier (making it possible to discard multiple cards after a single bleed).
Marijava Ghoul
Aching Beauty
Ventrue Investment
Guardian Angel
Mind of a Child
Sensory Deprivation
Protracted Investment
Lord of Serenity
Concordance
Shadowed Eyes
Seeds of Corruption
Lunatic Eruption
Heart of Darkness
Draught of the Soul
Increased Strength
Typhonic Beast
And just about all non-unique retainers.

wmseith wrote:

thanks. thought so but some of the players were arguing about it so just wanted to make sure.

As a general rule, everything stacks if it gives you a plus or minus to something. This doesn't apply if:

- the rules prevent you from playing the effect twice
- card text prevents you from doing it twice.

For example, playing Lost in Crowds (+ stealth) twice on an action would give you +4 stealth, except that you can't play the same action modifier twice with the same minion in a given action. In fact, Lost in Crowds twice does give you +4 stealth if minion A starts the action, plays Lost in Crowds, minion B takes over the action with Mask of a Thousand Faces, and minion B plays Lost in Crowds. Fun times.

Similarly, if you could play Conditioning (+ bleed) twice on an action, you could get +6 bleed. This is stopped both by the same action modifierrules, but also by its card text - so even if you play Mask, you can't play a second with another minion.

On permanents, a minion with three superior Jackals (+ stealth) has +6 stealth when their prey has a ready Follower or Assamite. Two Marijava Ghouls (+ stealth) on a minion gives your Presence actions +2 stealth. A Lasombra with multiple Drink the Blood of Ahriman (+ strength) has a stacking plus to strength and a stacking cost reducer - but will need to burn blood separately for each card.

A minion with two superior Fleshcrafts (- stealth) has -4 stealth. A minion with 4 superior Bonecrafts (- strength) has -8 strength.



Certain cards aren't plus-es or minus-es, they just set a value. For example, Torn Signpost sets your base strength to 2 (or 3). Multiple Torn Signposts will not stack - they just keep reseting it to 2. Other modifiers will stack on top of that, though.

Rumors of Gehenna sets your number of master phase actions to 2 (from 1), and will not stack with itself - or with Anson, who also sets it to two. Having both Anson and Rumors out - just two master phase actions. Anson plus the Parthenon - you can have three, 2 from Anson, and an additional one from tapping the Parthenon.


You can also have multiple of the same effect going off. For example, if you have three Wolf Companions, your opponent will take three damage at close range - one from each Companion. If you have three Anarch Revolts in play, each Methuselah burns three pool during their untap phase - one for each Revolt. These aren't stacking in exactly the same way as a cumulative plus-to-strength effect, but each provides its own effect which has to be resolved.

Army of Rats (mentioned earlier) would cause you to burn pool for each one, were it not for its own card text preventing that.