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04 Jan 2013 19:50 - 04 Jan 2013 19:54 #43621 by Trigger
Non-Mortal Minion was created by Trigger
This is probablly a no-brainer but in the following rule for Orun pertaining to the Non-Mortal Minion piece. If I don't want to burn one Orun by doing a (d) action, it would have to be tagrgeted towards a Mortal Ally and thats all, right?
I'm assuming all Vampires are Non-Mortal. :laugh:

If this laibon succesfully bleeds for more than 2 or succesfully performs a (D) action against a non-mortal minion, he or she burns one orun. Burn this card if this Laibon has more Orun and Aye than his capacity.
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Last edit: 04 Jan 2013 19:54 by Trigger.

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04 Jan 2013 20:53 - 04 Jan 2013 20:53 #43622 by Ohlmann
Replied by Ohlmann on topic Re: Non-Mortal Minion
It's more that no vampire currently printed have a text that make them considered as mortal. Sonja Blue being the closest to that, but still not quite.

If a vampire considered as a mortal were printed, you shouldn't target it either.

(There is also the case of imbued, but they are ally, and they are not mortal)
Last edit: 04 Jan 2013 20:53 by Ohlmann.

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04 Jan 2013 21:37 #43623 by Boris The Blade
Replied by Boris The Blade on topic Re: Non-Mortal Minion

(There is also the case of imbued, but they are ally, and they are not mortal)

Yes they are.

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05 Jan 2013 08:17 #43628 by Ankha
Replied by Ankha on topic Re: Non-Mortal Minion

(There is also the case of imbued, but they are ally, and they are not mortal)

Yes they are.

Indeed.

www.vekn.net/index.php/rulebook/appendix-imbued-rules

1. Imbued

Imbued are new crypt cards. An imbued is considered a mortal ally, not a vampire. Imbued have 1 strength and 1 bleed, by default. Their cost is also their starting life, and it is specified on each card individually (like capacity). They have creeds (like clans). They have virtues (like Disciplines, but only one level). When they have zero life, they are incapacitated (like torpor) instead of being burned (see 5 below). Any "burn ally" effect will still burn an imbued, however.

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05 Jan 2013 08:34 #43629 by Ohlmann
Replied by Ohlmann on topic Re: Non-Mortal Minion
Which is a huge fail from a lore viewpoint :p

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05 Jan 2013 09:53 - 05 Jan 2013 09:56 #43630 by jhattara
Replied by jhattara on topic Re: Non-Mortal Minion

Which is a huge fail from a lore viewpoint :p


whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Imbued_(cWOD)

"Hunters are specifically not turned into supernatural creatures when they are Imbued; they still need everything a normal human does and can't take Aggravated damage. All they are really given are abilities which allow them to resist, in various ways, the powers of truly supernatural enemies."

Mortals include any allies and retainers specifically named as mortals in their trait texts plus the imbued. And from the lore point of view the imbued are very much normal humans (read: mortals) with certain special abilities.

Every other minion and retainer is non-mortal.
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Last edit: 05 Jan 2013 09:56 by jhattara.

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05 Jan 2013 10:13 #43633 by Ohlmann
Replied by Ohlmann on topic Re: Non-Mortal Minion
Eh, they are like the mage : they are mortal in the sense they can die normally, but they are not regular mortal anymore. And mage doesn't have the mortal keyword.

(and I don't trust the wiki on this part since it's contradicted both by each and every explanation on their reason of existence and by the rules. It's the same as saying that mage and ghoul were regular mortals)

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05 Jan 2013 12:59 #43640 by KevinM
Replied by KevinM on topic Re: Non-Mortal Minion
Then trust the V:TES rules, which are available, have been quoted to you, and which should be the only consideration for your answer.
:)
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05 Jan 2013 13:46 #43641 by Ohlmann
Replied by Ohlmann on topic Re: Non-Mortal Minion

Then trust the V:TES rules, which are available, have been quoted to you, and which should be the only consideration for your answer.


Have I said the rule should be changed ? For me, it's the same thing as 2-cap using Reform Body or Breath of the dragon : a rule-induced lore silliness. Which I never petioned to change.

And rule *have* been the only consideration in my answer.

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07 Jan 2013 07:46 #43705 by Pascal Bertrand
Replied by Pascal Bertrand on topic Re: Non-Mortal Minion

This is probablly a no-brainer but in the following rule for Orun pertaining to the Non-Mortal Minion piece. If I don't want to burn one Orun by doing a (d) action, it would have to be tagrgeted towards a Mortal Ally and thats all, right?
I'm assuming all Vampires are Non-Mortal. :laugh:

If this laibon succesfully bleeds for more than 2 or succesfully performs a (D) action against a non-mortal minion, he or she burns one orun. Burn this card if this Laibon has more Orun and Aye than his capacity.

You can perform non-bleed actions directed at Methuselahs (such as Enticement, Revelations, ..), for Methuselahs are not mortal.
You can perform D actions against cards in play that are not mortal. This includes (but is not limited to): stealing the Powerbase: Montreal, playing Far Mastery to steal a Carlton Van Wyk, ..

So, the answer to your question is : "No - you have other options."
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