file First Tradition and Vessel

20 Oct 2013 16:13 #55497 by M.Schumacher
I'm sorry if this has been asked before but I couldnt find the answer
onlline.
Can u use Vessel and then burn 2 pool for first tradition: the masquerade?
The old card text said "While in play, each Methuselah must skip a turn or burn 2 pool".

The newest text is:
First Tradition: The Masquerade
Requires a prince or justicar.
If this referendum is successful, put this card in play. Each Methuselah must burn 2 pool during his or her untap phase. A Methuselah can choose to skip his or her entire turn. Burn this card when the controller has either skipped 3 turns or burned a total of 6 pool by this effect.

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20 Oct 2013 16:39 #55498 by blackday
as I remember no, you cant as skipping the turn means you don't get an untap phase. Actually you don't even untap any of your cards, as you skipped the whole turn including the untap phase.

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20 Oct 2013 16:55 #55499 by hardyrange
I think that the previous reply is correct in itself, but does not answer the question.

Can u use Vessel and then burn 2 pool for first tradition: the masquerade?

I think that is possible.

If you choose to have a turn, you are forced by the 1st Tradition to burn 2 pool during your untap phase.
But you can order all effects that happen in your untap phase as you like.
So you could choose to use a Vessel first, and thus gain the pool you would need to burn for the First Tradition.

"It was a perfect plan - until it had contact with reality"
---
Hardy Range
Playgroup Tradition Compliance Manager

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20 Oct 2013 17:09 #55502 by Pascal Bertrand

I'm sorry if this has been asked before but I couldnt find the answer
onlline.
Can u use Vessel and then burn 2 pool for first tradition: the masquerade?
The old card text said "While in play, each Methuselah must skip a turn or burn 2 pool".

The newest text is:
First Tradition: The Masquerade
Requires a prince or justicar.
If this referendum is successful, put this card in play. Each Methuselah must burn 2 pool during his or her untap phase. A Methuselah can choose to skip his or her entire turn. Burn this card when the controller has either skipped 3 turns or burned a total of 6 pool by this effect.

Due to First Tradition, before your turn even begins (which includes "before the untap phase", before gaining control of previously contested cards, ...), you must choose if you want to skip your turn.
If you skip your turn, your prey immediately gets the choice.

Otherwise (if you decide to take a turn, your untap phase begins normally, except that, amongst other "during your untap phase" effects (Edge, Anarch Revolt, Arika, Vessel, King's Rising, Gambit Accepted, Heart of Nizchetus, ...), there is a "burn 2 pool" effect to sequence.

You can very legitimately
- gain 1 blood from Owain Evans (on Owain)
- gain 1 blood from a Hunting Ground (on Owain)
- move 2 blood from Owain to your pool (via 2 Vessels on Owain)
- burn 2 pool to First Tradition.

(and, if there are two First Trads, gain 2 blood from the Rack on Blackhorse Tanner, move 2 blood from Blackhorse to your pool with 2 Vessels on Blackhorse, and burn 2 pool to First Tradition #2)

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