Re: Vlad Tepes + Regent

Borrelstein wrote:

what will happen when a prince enters torpor? Can Vlad use the card ability to receive and contest the title, and what title will he then receive?

Yes, he'll receive the title (there's a "but" coming up), and he'll receive the title that any normal Primogen would have received in that situation i.e. whatever the title on that Prince is.

The card requires a title, so his special is relevant. When he uses the burn clause, he uses the card as if he were a Camarilla Primogen. So he gets the title.

Here comes the but...

Borrelstein wrote:

Will he become a Camarilla once he starts the contest?

No. Receiving a title doesn't make you the sect that title requires.

Having a Camarilla title while being non-Camarilla means that his title goes inert - he receives no benefit from it.

Rulebook, wrote:

If a vampire with a title changes clans or sects to a clan or sect inappropriate for his title, he loses the benefit of the title until his clan or sect changes appropriately. If he receives a new title, or if his title is contested (see Contested Titles, sec. 4.2), he immediately yields the old title.

And since he's going to contest it with the Prince, he immediately yields it.

Thanks, that makes sense.
Still a nice vote boosting permanent for Vlad if he really wants to take that angle

Borrelstein wrote:

Still a nice vote boosting permanent for Vlad if he really wants to take that angle

Play Bloodbath instead. It's still not great, but it gives him a blood overall (1 cost, move 2 to him), and doesn't cost a blood for each vote he gets from it.

Once it's in play, he doesn't have to use his special with it - he "can" use cards as a vampire with a sect or title, he doesn't have to. So the card in play can see him as the Independent, untitled vampire he is, and give him a vote.

Not sure if you can play Bloodbath on Vlad. Sure he can play the card but I think he needs to play it on another vampire, as he can fake Sabbat only for the sake of playing a card but he can not be the target (similar to the Regent situation), as being target is not the same as 'use'?

Borrelstein wrote:

Not sure if you can play Bloodbath on Vlad. Sure he can play the card but I think he needs to play it on another vampire, as he can fake Sabbat only for the sake of playing a card but he can not be the target (similar to the Regent situation), as being target is not the same as 'use'?

When he plays it, he plays it as a titled Sabbat vampire (whichever of the titles you pick from the card) - per the earlier Kemintiri ruling, the title implies the sect.

So the card sees him as a Sabbat vampire for play and resolution purposes. Since he's seen as a Sabbat vampire, he's a legal target.

Pascal wrote:

jamesatzephyr wrote:

Purchase Pact is in play. Can Vlad Tepes call the +1 stealth political action to burn it? "Requires a ready archbishop, priscus, cardinal or regent. ... Any titled Sabbat vampire may call a referendum to burn this card as a +1 stealth political action."

Yes.

Can he burn it because the master itself has the requirement to play, or can he burn it because the action can only be taken by sabbat vampires?

Just trying to fully understand the ruling and this is the only example of it I've found