file Withdrawal deals

05 Apr 2020 21:59 #99506 by Hakuron
Withdrawal deals was created by Hakuron
Could we please verify that the following scenario is in accordance to the tournamanet rules:

4 player game, players A, B, C, D.
By the end of round two, A and B contest a 9-cap vampire.
By the end of round four, in addition A and B contest an 8-cap vampire.

A has no means of generating pool.
A is aware of the fact, that he will probably be ousted soon.
In addition, A can imagine that if he continues contesting the vampires until the very end, his prey will probably be ousted as well.

At the beginning of round 5, A proposes to B the following:
A would yield both contests. In return, B would withdraw, if B manages to oust C and D and if A is still in game, giving A 1 VP for his sacrifice.

Of course, if B succeeds to oust C and D in time, B is no longer bound to any deal, because they become null and void in the heads-up.
But if B wants to withdraw, he CAN do so, because afterwards he will have 2.5 VP and the game-win, the goal of the game.

(And not to forget, A would have done the best possible in the awkward game situation to maximise his VP.)

Thanks in advance!
:tore:

National Coordinator Germany
Toreador Prince of Darmstadt, Heart of the Jugendstil

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06 Apr 2020 01:07 #99507 by Boris The Blade
Replied by Boris The Blade on topic Withdrawal deals

Hakuron wrote: B is no longer bound to any deal, because they become null and void in the heads-up.

Nitpick here: deals are never binding, the duel rule means that former deals are not usable
anymore.

B may withdraw. A must attempt to oust if possible, so B has to cripple A enough that letting B withdraw becomes the better solution for A. That might no be too hard after A lost 2 vamps and B gained 12 pool.

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06 Apr 2020 08:41 - 06 Apr 2020 08:43 #99508 by Kiddo
Replied by Kiddo on topic Withdrawal deals
EDIT :I've re-rad the question, and player isn't attempting to withdraw during round 5, but negotiating future deals, so my answer is void. Sorry!
Last edit: 06 Apr 2020 08:43 by Kiddo.

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06 Apr 2020 14:53 #99509 by Ankha
Replied by Ankha on topic Withdrawal deals

Hakuron wrote: Could we please verify that the following scenario is in accordance to the tournamanet rules:

4 player game, players A, B, C, D.
By the end of round two, A and B contest a 9-cap vampire.
By the end of round four, in addition A and B contest an 8-cap vampire.

A has no means of generating pool.
A is aware of the fact, that he will probably be ousted soon.
In addition, A can imagine that if he continues contesting the vampires until the very end, his prey will probably be ousted as well.

At the beginning of round 5, A proposes to B the following:
A would yield both contests. In return, B would withdraw, if B manages to oust C and D and if A is still in game, giving A 1 VP for his sacrifice.

Of course, if B succeeds to oust C and D in time, B is no longer bound to any deal, because they become null and void in the heads-up.
But if B wants to withdraw, he CAN do so, because afterwards he will have 2.5 VP and the game-win, the goal of the game.

(And not to forget, A would have done the best possible in the awkward game situation to maximise his VP.)

Thanks in advance!
:tore:

Since withdrawing would give B the GW once C and D are ousted, it is valid from B's point of view.
In the duel, A must maximize his VPs. This includes letting B withdraw if A can't score more than 1 vp.

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
The following user(s) said Thank You: Hakuron, beslin igor

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13 Sep 2020 15:20 #100768 by gatocion
Replied by gatocion on topic Withdrawal deals
Hi!
Similar question but with a different scenario.
Player A has already 1VP, has 3 vampires and 2 Nocturn.
Player B already dead.
Player C 2 vampires, at 1 or 2 pool.
Player D 3 vampires and 2 rockcats.

Player's C turn. Seeing that he will get ousted next turn he offers a deal to player D. With Kindred spirit he will bleed A as much as he can, if player D gets to kill player A, then he will allow player C to withdraw.

Player D cannot oust A without C help, and if C gets ousted, he will most surely be ousted, so he agrees on the deal.

C and D manage to oust A.

Is D bound to the previous deal in the 1 to 1 situation?

It's up to its interpretation of the given situation of being able, or not, to oust C or maybe being ousted first, as C has stealth and a great bleeding power.

Thanks!

VEKN#4200008

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13 Sep 2020 16:08 #100769 by Lech
Replied by Lech on topic Withdrawal deals
No, he isn't. But on the other hand, with 2vp he could let him have his point.

:laso: :CEL: :DOM: :OBT: :POT: :cap8:
Sabbat.Black Hand Shakar: Lech loathe ranged weapons. Once each action, he may burn 1 blood to become Camarilla Prince of Krakow until the end of the action.

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