file Ravnos animals & bleed

03 Jul 2014 07:16 - 03 Jul 2014 07:17 #63488 by Posco
Replied by Posco on topic Ravnos animals & bleed
Okay, thank you! I don't know why I was 100% sure it had to be a younger Ravnos... :huh:


This past night, after the game, I made some changes to the deck, following some advices you gave. Is it any better now? Basically, I put Indomitaility/HiddenStrength, 2 more chimerstry, ravnos carnival and blood doll,more taste, more carrion, zero aid from bats, ...


Apparition would be a good choice? And with which vamp would you replace Kiradin?



Deck Name: Ravnos ANI FOR CHI MODIFICADO
Created By: Posco
Description:


Crypt: (12 cards, Min: 17, Max: 32, Avg: 6,08)
2 Anjalika Underwood ANI aus chi for5 Ravnos
1 Brian Thompson ani chi for 4 Ravnos
2 Callirus ani CHI FOR 5 Ravnos
2 Chavi Oraczko ANI CHI FOR nec7 Ravnos
2 Kiradin CHI DEM FOR ani pot8 Ravnos
1 Marion French ani chi 3 Ravnos
2 Vasiliy Vasilevich ANI CHI for pro8 Ravnos

Library: (85 cards)
Master (21 cards)
6 Blood Doll
4 Chimerstry
1 Kumpania
1 Park Hunting Ground
3 Path of Paradox, The
4 Ravnos Carnival
2 Week of Nightmares

Action (9 cards)
3 Sensory Deprivation
6 Tumnimos

Action Modifier (9 cards)
6 Fata Morgana
3 Freak Drive

Reaction (8 cards)
2 Cats` Guidance
3 On the Qui Vive
3 Wake with Evening`s Freshness

Combat (24 cards)
1 Armor of Vitality
8 Carrion Crows
2 Hidden Strength
3 Indomitability
3 Skin of Steel
7 Taste of Vitae

Retainer (3 cards)
3 Raven Spy

Combo (11 cards)
1 Draba
5 Mirror Image
5 Occlusion
Last edit: 03 Jul 2014 07:17 by Posco.

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03 Jul 2014 16:34 #63495 by Haze
Replied by Haze on topic Ravnos animals & bleed
Jayakumar would be an excellent replacement for Kiradin. he can steal equipment as an action, and if anyone blocks you get a chance to play combat cards.

if you're worried about not having enough bleed to finish someone off, try Paul Forrest the False Prophet.

Apparition is very strong when you can consistently get presses, because it lasts the whole combat. so if you use it, you'll want more Indomitability or Traps to go with it. Armor of Vitality isn't too great here.

Underbridge Stray would be a good ally to use here, if you have any.

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04 Jul 2014 12:28 - 04 Jul 2014 12:31 #63503 by jamesatzephyr
Could you provide some more details about the sort of decks you face, and how aggressive players are? The rest of what I say below is basically expanding on that.

Posco wrote: I managed up to get 4 vamps out (Chavi, Vasilyi, Brian and Callirus), and no Tumnimos came out. I blood dolled my 4 vamps, so my pool did not went out too fast.


With only 4 Blood Dolls in the deck, you were able to doll all 4? That sounds like a rather lucky shuffle. But that's, what, 24 pool of vampires. What was your Ventrue bleed-ish/vote-ish predator doing? With Fortitude (Freak Drive) and Presence (Majesty untap) available in abundance for the Ventrue generally, you'd generally expect to see a deck that's able to do things like bleed you with Threats or Conditioning, then untap for a Kine Resources Contested or Parity Shift. And if he has, say, Mustafa the Heir or Lodin along for the ride - or any of a host of available Princes - he can fuel up on vampires to go lower than you on pool quite rapidly, then steal yours off you with Parity. Even without Parity Shift, it's relatively easy for a Ventrue deck with two vampires out to be doing at least three actions (one Freak Drive) for 3 pool each against you in one turn - one or two KRCs, one or two bleeds with a modifier. Toss in Mind Rape for giggles.

I'm not suggesting it should be able to do that every single turn, or anything like that. But I would expect to see a deck like that be able to pressure you with 3-5 pool damage a turn - either directly, or with bounce. And in a good turn (which it might hold back so that it can lunge), you would expect to see it able to unleash quite a bit more.


It's also not clear what the Euro-Brujah deck was doing. Obvious things it can do include blocking your bleeds and beating you up, and you don't have that much combat defence if a Second Tradition/Immortal Grapple deck maneuvers to close, hits you, Tastes your blood (if you didn't prevent), presses from the Immortal Grapple (Donal, Constanza, Theo and Anvil have POT, though Volker and Rake don't) or Flash, and hits you again. Alternatively, it could be bouncing you after you play your Fata Morgana, with the reasonable amount of Dominate it has lurking around (again on Donal, Constanza, Anvil and Theo). Alternatively alternatively, it could be back rushing you - not all the time, and not crushing you to death, so it doesn't give its grand-predator (your predator) a free VP or anything, but if you had a CHI vampire with a Samadji, or something like that, you might expect to see it get thumped a bit.

Again, not suggesting that the only thing your prey is doing is thwarting you - he needs to do his own thing and oust your grand-prey too - but you would generally expect him to rankle a little bit about having a CHI predator. Tumnimos + Week of Nightmares is a known trick. Sensory Deprivation and Reality are very annoying at depriving a deck of actions, and knocking a big CHI vamp into torpor with Second Tradition + Immortal Grapple is a common enough ploy.

Basically, if you could get 4 vampires out, and have them all around to fuel Week of Nightmares, it does feel like the players around you may be rather more passive than would be expected in a relatively competitive tournament.



Additionally, if you won the game with 1.5VP, presuambly no-one else got any VPs. Which means you were throwing down Week of Nightmares down onto a table with 4 other Methuselahs on it, which is usually unpleasant for you because it means the counters come off much more quickly than they would if there were fewer players left. Which will mean you get much less out of it (few vampires, fewer turns), and probably at least one dead vampire - probably whoever is the biggest threat/has the most permanents on them. And maybe more - you have some blood conservation by way of Carnival and Path, but you'd expect most of your vampires to be down at least a little, even on a combat free table. Especially when your main source of pool gain is Blood Doll (or any similar master - Vessel, Villein etc.) So I'd worry that even without a timeout, what you've effectively done here is lunge for 1 VP, while also killing most of your vampires, meaning that if the game did carry on much longer, you wouldn't stand much chance of the GW anyway.
Last edit: 04 Jul 2014 12:31 by jamesatzephyr.

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04 Jul 2014 17:10 #63509 by ReverendRevolver
Yea, Erobru and Ventrue on either side makes me wonder how you held on.
All I can think of is bad deck/draw for both, since most of my ventrue decks are just too aggressive to have problems with crows+bats. Even less aggressive ones would typically just oit-minion this kind of deck (Maryanne,lodin,mustafa,victorxboth, graham or lucinde,victorine,mustafa,victor, muhktar, or nash, bridges, anne, wilhelm, crowly, you get the idea) the not drawing daring the dawn shuldnt matter much when you can govern bonding, freakdrive or majesty into KRC/p shift.

Euro Bru im not a fan of. Too overdone, not enough actions, I like celerity guns WAY too much to add in potence instead, even if dom is a plus. BUT. Eurobru should be stomping on every action you take. 9-14 second trad, bouncing your bleeds, etc. Also beast n bell means id be flattening stuff. But, they signpost, grapple, blur/pursuit, and do like 6 or 9 damage, preventing with sideslip maybe. You can press to end, but you probably cant strike if you batted and were grappled.
You should be able to roll with the punches in those situations, or maybe dodge. But not sure how you gor through that with ventrue behind you.

Decidd what you want.

You can up draba, combat, and add deepsong to crush stralthbleed and block better, you can up bugs to bleed more, you get the idea.

Id run RwtP in bigger numbers if I KNEW celerity guns and additional strike grapple was in my future. Amor of vitality is perfect for inferior fortitude against animalism. Prevent n press has its place too. But all these are stuff to think on.

Then remember you have to oust and not be ousted, and redcards are always distant mrans to that end in most cases.

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