file [Submission] Keeper of Tradition (Camarilla reward for playing Traditions)

11 Dec 2014 16:10 - 11 Dec 2014 16:11 #68117 by Ankha

jamesatzephyr wrote:

Ankha wrote: Name: Keeper of Tradition
Cardtype: Action
+1 stealth action. Requires a ready prince or justicar.
Remove from your ash heap 3 different tradition cards that this vampire has played. This Camarilla vampire gets +2 bleed and +2 vote. Burn this card if this vampire changes sect.


Could you explain the game need?

It's to encourage people to play the various tradition cards (especially 4th and 5th that are rarely played; the 6th is even rarer) by rewarding them. Who plays 5th Traditions nowadays (even though it's an okay card) ?

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
Last edit: 11 Dec 2014 16:11 by Ankha.

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11 Dec 2014 17:26 - 11 Dec 2014 17:29 #68119 by jamesatzephyr

Ankha wrote: It's to encourage people to play the various tradition cards (especially 4th and 5th that are rarely played; the 6th is even rarer) by rewarding them. Who plays 5th Traditions nowadays (even though it's an okay card) ?


Assuming the card shakes down as being worth playing at all, I'd expect that what it's massively more likely to do is encourage people to continue to play the good tradition cards (2nd, 3rd already played a fair bit, a smattering of 1st) and include one or two others if necessary. That is, if it has any impact at all, it would be to make Camarilla Prince decks using good traditions better. And since those Camarilla Prince decks are typically already using cards like Parity Shift which are very good indeed, I'm not sure they need the help - I'm not sure that making, say, a CAmarilla breed deck with Parity Shift, Second Tradition, Third Tradition, a few Con Boons, and encouraging it to add a couple of First Traditions is actually giving Fourth and Fifth a shot in the arm, or encouraging deck diversity, or anything else. Maybe a breed-boon deck stuffed with 2nd and 3rd gets three Fifth Tradition to refill itself (e.g. Prince1 tops up Prince2 a bit), and to get more votes and more bleed - making a very, very solid deck that bit stronger.

The basic thing is: Camarilla Prince decks can already be very strong. If this is worth playing, it would make them stronger. I don't really see that being warranted.
Last edit: 11 Dec 2014 17:29 by jamesatzephyr.

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11 Dec 2014 19:17 #68121 by Ankha

jamesatzephyr wrote: The basic thing is: Camarilla Prince decks can already be very strong. If this is worth playing, it would make them stronger.

No, because they'll have to add some traditions that weren't there in the first place. And there was a good reason if they weren't there in the first place: the deck was better without them... that's where you hope that adding some copies of Keeper of Tradition is worth the effort.

Prince of Paris, France
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12 Dec 2014 05:53 #68129 by Lech
Um, it's perfect card for nosferatu princes. Do you think it need more help?

:laso: :CEL: :DOM: :OBT: :POT: :cap8:
Sabbat.Black Hand Shakar: Lech loathe ranged weapons. Once each action, he may burn 1 blood to become Camarilla Prince of Krakow until the end of the action.
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12 Dec 2014 07:26 - 12 Dec 2014 07:26 #68130 by Ankha

Lech wrote: Um, it's perfect card for nosferatu princes. Do you think it need more help?

Could you develop?
I suppose you're talking about Nosferatu because you have "Nosferatu royalties" archetype in mind ( Ruben's deck is a good example). Unfortunately, that kind of decks don't play that many Traditions. First, usually they focus on 2nd and 3rd tradition, meaning a third different tradition is missing. Of if they play also another tradition, the quantities are low (meaning it's unlikely to draw the 3 different traditions early in the game). And most importantly, they rely a lot on Third Tradition that doesn't go easily in the ash heap once played (someone has to burn the Progeny).

Basically, you can't just add that card in a Nosferatu Royalty deck and expect it to work. You'll have to add more traditions, more various, less focused and that's the intent.

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Last edit: 12 Dec 2014 07:26 by Ankha.

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12 Dec 2014 07:55 #68131 by Timo
Yes, you ca't realy add this card to any good existing deck out of the box.

BUT, there is allready a lot of good deck heavily rellying on traditions. And he effect of your proposal is kind of huge (it has the same effect of legendary vampire which is unique, is a master, cost 2 pools + an opportunity cost and is removable).

And considering it is designed specifically for a tech (prince/justicar and traditions) which has already very good tools (parity, 2nd trad etc...). What is dansgerous with your proposal is the fact that it is another powerfull card for an already powerfull tech. And yes, it is not very easily done "out of the box" but, I am pretty sure someone will find a very good deck out of it.

It is cool to add good cards in order to make people come with different ideas. But I guess it is better done with tech which has not allready very good stuff...

And just my own idea of wha can be done with that :

Base of the deck :

Deck Name: Blood Weakens: Son of Malkav
Author: Danilo Torrisi
Description:
Blood Weakens
Massa, Italy
June 9, 2013
20 Players
2R + F



Crypt (12 cards; Capacity min=7 max=11 avg=9.25)
================================================
3xx Lutz von Hohenzollern 11 pot AUS DEM OBF PRE Malkavian:4
3xx Maris Streck 9 ani dem dom AUS OBF Malkavian:3
3xx Quentin King III 7 obf pre AUS DEM Malkavian:3
3xx Rachel Brandywine 10 ani AUS DEM OBF PRO Malkavian:3

Library (75 cards)
==================
Master (22)
1x Creepshow Casino
1x Direct Intervention
1x Giant's Blood
1x Heidelberg Castle, Germany
3x Madness Network
1x Monastery of Shadows
1x Pentex(TM) Subversion
1x Temptation of Greater Power
2x Villein
10x Zillah's Valley

Action (1)
1x Judgment: Camarilla Segregation

Political Action (24)
6x First Tradition: The Masquerade
3x Kine Resources Contested
5x My Kin Against the World
10x Parity Shift

Equipment (4)
2x Heart of Nizchetus
2x Sargon Fragment, The

Action Modifier (10)
4x Elder Impersonation
6x Lost in Crowds

Reaction (10)
6x Mental Maze
4x Second Tradition: Domain

Combo (4)
4x Swallowed by the Night

Created with Secret Library v0.9.4c. (Dec 12, 2014 10:52:34)

One of the problem with my kin against the world and maris streck is blood management.

So you tweack the list in order to add some fifth trad, a little bit more second trad and some copies of KoT.

I am pretty sure someone can find a very good improvement...

And you could do the same with rachel and greger I guess and without the my kin against the world.

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