New set in 2012

I feel the urge to respond in this thread, since I have been mentioned multiple times (being one of the lurking Dutch players of the V:tES community - I've been playing the game since Jyhad and have always been checking out the newsgroup and WW fora before; been a member here for 12+ months).

A few things I'd like to get out of the way before I make my contribution to this thread.

First being this: Izaak is NOT representing the Dutch V:tES community. Being one of the more 'vocal' members obviously, and one that has a very impressive grasp on the rules and concept of the game we all like to play, not to mention his knowledge of the card-pool of V:tES and even the various errata on those very cards (for which I respect him very much), I wish to distance myself from statements that appear to be the general opinion of the Dutch V:tES community.

And another issue: although the Dutch are indeed well-known for their direct approach and even bluntness, compared to just about everyone else in the world, some of us have taken this 'bluntness' to a whole new level, which is NOT the way everyone else in the Netherlands (I prefer to use this name over 'Holland') behaves or acts. To assume this is the case (or to state that this IS the case) is insulting to the Dutch in general.

I have been asking around about the fact that so few Dutch players contribute on this forum within my own playgroup (and asked a few people outside that group as well) to get an idea why participation in the 'community' might seem low.

The general answer I get to this is that folks like me DO check the (former) newsgroup, WW forum and now the V:EKN forum, but dislike being part of seemingly endless discussions that often turn into arguments or even insults.

Ofcourse it's good to discuss things, and many great posts can be found carrying very constructive information on many different subjects, but the general feeling folks over here have (mind you - I speak for myself and part of my playgroup, who I discussed with about this yesterday) is that many guys in here think they're more important than others, and are destined to convince others of their own opinion, leaving little to no room for debate. Arguments and even insults reïnforce this feeling.

To many players, V:tES is a very enjoyable, original, out-of-the-box and inspiring game, with countless possibilities for being original and trying out new concepts and decks and all. But the emphasis lies on the word 'game'. Not everyone likes to get drawn into discussions about something that's supposed to be entertaining, but which sometimes turns into overly serious discussions, arguments and insults.

So yes, many of us are here, lurking the forum, reading about many things but not interfering with too many discussions.

Which gets me back to the topic of this thread (sorry for diverting).

To me, this new set has to prove itself before I can and will vent my opinion on it. I trust the people involved in creating it, and am very curious about what we might see when it gets done. There's no doubt in my mind it won't be any good - only the creators of the new 'cards' can spoil that for me by releasing game-breaking library cards or crappy new minions. I can share my thoughts on the new set with you once I've seen it.

I DO have some questions about the legality of the new 'fan-made PDF set' and on how to handle the product once it's out.

As I understand, I am to print out the PDF cards on a regular sheet of paper (any specifics for the paper are lost to me), then cut them out properly, and then shove them in a sleeve, along with a regular V:tES card, for it to be tournament-legal, correct?

Who's going to decide the quality of the print is sufficient enough?
If, for example, our NC decides it's good enough, is there a way for me to be sure that judges and/or organizers for the EC agree on that deciscion?
In other words; do you have specific guidelines to what is 'good quality' or will it be arbitrary to the occasion?

I read that it will be illegal (for tournament play) if I decide to have a professional printing company print the new set on a decent sheet of cardboard, including the correct card backs printed double-sided and have them cut-out like 'the real deal'. This mostly because of copyright and other rules and laws about the cards.

How is it different if I go to a copyshop to have them print my PDF on a sheet of paper (not all of us have decent color-printers at home, you know)? I will still be paying a third party for the print, in which case that party will make some profit out of the PDF cards, which will make it just as illegal as when I go for the 'double-sided cardboard version' of the new set, right?

I would really like to know this, since the most humiliating thing I could imagine is me being disqualified and sent home (I know, that won't happen, but hypothetically so...) from any kind of official event I wish to participate in.

Just some thoughts...

I would like to add that I do appreciate the energy many of you still put into keeping V:tES alive, and hope for youi all to keep up the good work.

But please keep in mind that, although not everyone is just as vocal as som other folks in here, there are still a lot of us supporting you and trusting you in what you do.

I just realize this is only my second post on this forum (the Dutch V:tES forum still is used very actively by lots of us Dutch players, if you wish to know), and that this got to be a VERY long reply - my other one is more in a style that fits me; a very short answer to a very clear question, leaving little or no room for debate leading to arguments leading to insults

But I still hope this does not make me less a member of the V:tES community than would I have been more vocal. I'm still here, and I will contribute in my own way. Do not give up on me (and us, for that matter).

wow, when i think about it there can be some incredibly heated debates on these forums.....
i believe the reason for the rule on printed cards is there would potentially be legal risks with encouraging players to have essentially counterfeit cards made (even though they wouldn't be copies of owned cards, they would still posses intellectual properties owned by WW, CCP, and Hasbro). the vekn being a non profit organization isn't financially stacked to handle any of that sort of thing. although i agree printed cards of the new set would be awesome.......

Angel74 wrote:

As I understand, I am to print out the PDF cards on a regular sheet of paper (any specifics for the paper are lost to me), then cut them out properly, and then shove them in a sleeve, along with a regular V:tES card, for it to be tournament-legal, correct?

You got it right.
Only one detail missing though: the print needs to be a colour print.

I don't recall any other specifis being gives, but Iäd assume a reasonable resolution would be nice. Then again, I'm sure that if you use the forthcoming official files to do colour prints there'll be no problems.

Your local printing/office supply store probably has the option for you to print at 300dpi on 80gsm paper (standard photocopy style paper).

Officeworks, Kinkos, etc all do this sort of thing.

I wouldn't have too many problems with a Greyscale printing of the cards, but if there was an official statement of "Your must print it in Colour" then I'd be happy to agree to that.

Colour prints on regular 80gpsm paper are fine.
We'd like to discourage cardboard prints, as it may result in eBay sales ("I sell real quality cards"), which we don't want.