Does Catatonic Fear + Target Vitals work?

FOR PASCAL:

Does Catatonic Fear + Target Vitals "work"?
Why or Why Not?
Links please, thank you for your time

in a nutshell !
lsj already ruled that it works.
(search the old google groups EDIT: did it for ya : groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/plqseTAyBJo)

The damage cannot be prevented by usual means (cause it's done outside combat).
If you dodge, you are protected from it, as usual.

And you can always discard two combat cards to cancel TV as it is played.

KevinM wrote:

FOR PASCAL:

Does Catatonic Fear + Target Vitals "work"?
Why or Why Not?
Links please, thank you for your time

Name: Catatonic Fear
Cardtype: Combat
Cost: 1 blood
Discipline: Presence

 Strike: combat ends.

 As above, and inflict 1 damage to the opposing minion once combat ends if the range is close.



Name: Target Vitals

Cardtype: Combat

Aim. Play when choosing a strike.

If any damage from this strike is successfully inflicted on the opposing minion, he or she takes an additional 2 damage from this strike, and he or she cannot press this round. The opposing minion may discard two combat cards [COMBAT] to cancel this card. A minion may play only one aim each strike.





Yes, it "works" (i.e. Catatonic Fear would inflict 1+2 damage after combat ends). Reyda provided the link: 
	[LSJ 20070927]
.



Why: because Catatonic Fear is a strike that inflicts damage (if it isn't prevented*), and Target Vitals add damage to a damage-inflicting strike.



*: Remember, only Leather Jacket can save you from Catatonic Fear's damage. Regular combat cards can't, as they are only usable in combat, and Catatonic Fear's damage happens after combat has ended.

Surge would also save an imbued since the counters last for the duration of the action.(Note that react with conviction could also be used to cancel the Catatonic as it is played. )

This same ruling also came to apply to Loving Agony, incidentally, which I think is the only other effec that comes under the same mechanism.

(The two cards were worded differently, but actually inflict the damage in the same way, afaik.)

Both of the forms of damage are bound to the strike.
They are both "S:CE and XYZ" (like Majesty). So when you declare the strike you may also play TV (choosing the strike) and TV only checks "Did this strike deal damage?" and not "Was damage inflicted on the opposing minion by this striking minion?" (i.e. it is not worded Disarm). If the strike deals damage (including environmental damage) then the TV triggers itself and adds 2 to that damage.

If you S:D either Catatonic or Loving Agony you should, because you avoid all effects of a strike which targets you by using a S:D, avoid the damage outside combat of both cards and neutralise TV.


Target Vitals
Type: Combat
Aim. Play when choosing a strike.
If any damage from this strike is successfully inflicted on the opposing minion, he or she takes an additional 2 damage from this strike, and he or she cannot press this round. The opposing minion may discard two combat cards [COMBAT] to cancel this card. A minion may play only one aim each strike.

Disarm
Type: Combat
Requires: Potence
[pot] Only usable at the end of a round of combat in which this vampire successfully inflicted more damage at close range than the opposing vampire. Not usable by a vampire being burned or going into torpor. Put this card on the opposing vampire and send that vampire into torpor. The vampire with this card has -1 strength. He or she may burn this card by burning 3 blood. A vampire can have only one Disarm.
[POT] As above, but the vampire with this card has -2 strength.

Ankha wrote:

@Juggernaut: yes, I was just pointing out that Loving Agony was "environmental" damage, whereas Catatonic Fear is inflicted by the minion.
It could matter if Saulot is in combat with Nergal (with valeren). Saulot wouldn't take any damage from a Catatonic Fear, but would take damage from a Loving Agony.

I was just making the difference between TV and Disarm's check for the damage. TV checks the strike, Disarm checks the minion.