file Lost Kindred FAQ

11 May 2018 09:51 - 11 May 2018 09:56 #86769 by Ankha
Lost Kindred FAQ was created by Ankha
This topic will be updated as new questions will be asked.

Q: I plan to play Emerald Legionnaire with no Harbingers of Skulls, just by discarding them and bringing them back from the ash heap at a later point. Is that legal? How does it work?

A: You cannot use an Emerald Legionnaire ability from the ash heap (this is true for all cards in any ash heap), so you need to find a way to put an Emerald Legionnaire in play first. The easiest way is to recruit it with a Harbinger of Skulls, but you can also put it in play by other means (Summon History, etc.) Only ready Emerald Legionnaire can use their ability.

Q: Righteous Aura states "Burn this card if this vampire is about to leave the ready region." Is there any subtilty in the "about to leave" wording?

A: Timing has been redefined to be clearer than a simple "when". Here is the ordered list of time frames:
  1. when X would happen... Y happens instead: replacement effects take place when X is going to happen, but before it happens. X does not happen at all, and Y happens instead. E.g., "when X would enter combat, X burns 1 blood instead": X never entered combat. Only one replacement effect can be used for a given condition: for instance, once the replacement effect "when X would enter combat, X burns 1 blood instead" has been used, X is no longer entering combat so another "when X would enter combat" cannot take place. Replacement effects can be used one after the other if the new condition is met, for instance "when X burns 1 blood" replacement effect could now be used in the previous example.
  2. when X is about to happen: it happens right before X happens (but X is certain to happen, it cannot be replaced anymore), e.g., when X is about to enter combat..., when combat is about to end...
  3. as it is played / as it enters play: typically used for cancellation effects, or enter play effects such as an Anarch Convert who enters play, then removes itself from play before the contest begins. "As it enters play" happens right after "is about to enter play", but before any state-based effects such as contesting (see 4/)
  4. (when / if / whenever) <state-based condition>: happens right after the effect that changed the state, e.g. "when it has no counter" (either because the last counter was removed, or because it entered play without any counter). Contesting is a state-based effect. The difference between "when", "if", and "whenever" is cosmetic: "when" suggests that the condition is very likely to be met (e.g. "when it has no counter"), otherwise "if" is used ("if this vampire is ready"), and "whenever" suggests that the condition is likely to be met more than once, but is seldom used for state-based effects.
  5. after X happens: happens right after X happens. For actions, this is during the "after resolution" step of the action. E.g., Baba Yaga ("Baba Yaga can unlock after successfully recruiting an ally or employing a retainer") unlocks "after" the retainer is employed. If it is an employ action, it is after resolution of the action, otherwise (in combat for instance) it is right after the retainer has been employed. "Synner-G can unlock after successfully equipping with an electronic equipment from your hand." works the same way.

Different effects that use the same time frame are sequenced using the impulse. For instance, a vampire who has played Daring the Dawn during an action takes aggravated damage after the resolution. If you want to play a Freak Drive, you can play it either before or after the damage are inflicted.

Righteous Aura burns right before the vampire leaves the ready region. This is meaningful when Banishment is played on the vampire for instance. Righteous Aura is burned before the vampire goes to the uncontrolled region and the other cards become out-of-play.

Q: Is "limited" a keyword? What does superior Command of the Beast say?

A: "(limited)" is NOT a keyword. Keywords are never written in parentheses. The fact that "action modifiers that increase the bleed are now limited" is written down in the rules. Command of the Beast at inferior for instance counts against the limit. The reminder "(limited)" could be removed with no impact on the card.
Superior Command of the Beast cannot say "+1 bleed." because it would be subject to the limitation rule. That is why it states explicitly that it is not restricted by the rule: "[DOM] +1 bleed that does not count against the limit."
(It uses, in fact, the same wording as Quickness).

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
Last edit: 11 May 2018 09:56 by Ankha.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Lönkka, self biased, mjvtes521, TwoRazorReign, Bloodartist, kschaefer

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11 May 2018 11:26 #86770 by the1andonlime
Replied by the1andonlime on topic Lost Kindred FAQ
I find the ruling on the EL extremely counterintuitive, and a potential logistical nightmare (imagine if multiple copies entered your ashheap both from the ready region and from other zones).

Other card games have the opposite ruling for ashheap effects AFAIK.


Nathaneal (Y.Y.)
Inceptor Asian Continental Championship
domainsg.blogspot.com

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11 May 2018 11:41 #86772 by the1andonlime
Replied by the1andonlime on topic Lost Kindred FAQ
Nevermind, I think I've figured out what the intent was. So a ready EL can move another EL from the ashheap into the ready region.

Curious why the word "another" wasn't used as that would make the effect unambiguous.


Nathaneal (Y.Y.)
Inceptor Asian Continental Championship
domainsg.blogspot.com

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11 May 2018 12:07 #86774 by ReverendRevolver
Replied by ReverendRevolver on topic Lost Kindred FAQ
When is set legal for tournament play?

Most US players could have possession next week, and most EU players by June 1st. Is June 1st the legal date?

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11 May 2018 12:09 - 11 May 2018 12:13 #86775 by Ankha
Replied by Ankha on topic Lost Kindred FAQ

the1andonlime wrote: Nevermind, I think I've figured out what the intent was. So a ready EL can move another EL from the ashheap into the ready region.

Curious why the word "another" wasn't used as that would make the effect unambiguous.

Not if you have two EL in your ash heap...
Considering the number of oopsies involving that card, I'll think about some way to make it crystal clear.

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
Last edit: 11 May 2018 12:13 by Ankha.

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11 May 2018 13:59 - 11 May 2018 14:01 #86777 by GreyB
Replied by GreyB on topic Lost Kindred FAQ

Ankha wrote: I'll think about some way to make it crystal clear.

Ankha wrote: You cannot use an Emerald Legionnaire ability from the ash heap (this is true for all cards in any ash heap)


Is crystal clear.

There was also another card from DM with similar ability, same applies to that card.

:garg: :VIS: :POT: :FOR: :flight: -1 Strength
Last edit: 11 May 2018 14:01 by GreyB.

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