file Tygerius allegiance counters and going Anarch

26 Jun 2018 05:42 #88392 by Oshi
Camarilla: If Tegyrius is ready, any Assamite may take a +1 stealth action to gain an allegiance counter. Any Assamite with an allegiance counter is considered a Camarilla vampire. +1 strength. Blood cursed.

Does an assamite with an allegiance counter that goes anarch change sect?

If so, if he gets a second allegiance counter does he change sect again?

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26 Jun 2018 14:14 #88397 by kschaefer

Does an assamite with an allegiance counter that goes anarch change sect?

Yes, by nature of going anarch. A vampire many have only one sect. The most recent sect change will take precedence.

If so, if he gets a second allegiance counter does he change sect again?

Tegyrius's card text doesn't say it (he was made before changing sect was easy, ie going Anarch), but I'd burn the Allegiance counter to prevent the conflict with game state. Therefore, the Allegiance Counter -> Anarch -> Allegiance Counter vampire should end up with only one Allegiance Counter in the end.

I couldn't find anything on the old google groups page about this. Interested to hear Ankha's take.

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26 Jun 2018 15:28 #88398 by Ratadin
This can be understood in two ways: either this was an old mechanic and the "allegiance counter" is a way to say "this assamita becomes Camarrilla", in which case the counter should be understood as would a regular anarch counter, burning if you change sect; or this was a different mechanic and by specifying an "allegiance counter" without a burning clause they intended for a permanent change, as "this assamita is now bound to this pact and cannot get out of the camarilla", which could be an interesting mechanic, but which is only induce by omision of a burning clause (which is specified on other anarch cards, but not all of them).

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26 Jun 2018 17:25 #88399 by Sambomb
By card text: The Allegiance counter don’t burn when you change sects.
And while the Allegiance counter are on any Assamite they are considered Camarilla.

So you turn to anarch and goes back to Camarilla right after

Archbishop of Itaocara
Prince ID #510

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26 Jun 2018 17:31 #88400 by kschaefer
Sure, but that feels broken. Hoping Ankha will provide clarity and possibly a text update to handle that oddness.

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26 Jun 2018 21:01 #88401 by Ankha
There is a distinction between a vampire who changes sect, and a vampire who "is considered" a given sect.
Allegiance counters, like Writ of Acceptance, is some kind of continuous effect. A vampire with an allegiance counter who changes his sect to X remains Camarilla. As soon as he looses his allegiance counter, that vampire's sect resumes to X.

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