Printing own cards

self wrote:

Timo wrote:

I don't know doomtown but to my understanding, netrunner new gen is another game with he same concept, not the revival of the old one.

For example, if VTES were to be back in print with the same concept, you could not use your parity shift nor your Arika.

(It is what I was explained but I don't know for sure)

Edit : I will likely throw my keybord if it continues to be this annoying...

i'm not sure i'd consider V:tes a proper/true CCG (not really on topic, but i can make a new thread a little later).

i'd be 100% behind a full reset/rules pruning. I'd also be in favor of moving from Masquerade to Requiem. the whole "Well, it's Methuselahs, so anything is possible" rationalization of camarilla/sabbat interactions is just too much for me, and i find the Requiem setting more fitting to how V:tes plays. Also, in Requiem each clan has it's own unique* discipline, and Masquerade, there are many clans that don't.

my playgroup is okay with proxies/printing cards so long as they're easily recognizable. the majority of my group also has no interest in sanctioned/competitive play. i suspect that more people would be interested in sanctioned play if they could use their proxies, but for the most part, we're content.

*for moderate values of unique

Nwod has a good dice system and AMAZING limites run games.

But requiem is terrible. Typically, conversations jump to people saying "...if you house rule...." and thats the point. Terrible. Fog of ages isnt terrible, but only to set mood and keep things murky, its dumb to have no real history, especially saying "nobody will ever know what happenes in the past" and then releasing a Roman variant.

Now, numerically it looks better, but still isnt. Clans are terrible if strict spreads are used ( and learning skills are tediois, even though premade characters have plenty of out of clan stuff) and sects are so-so. And its all more city based than vtm, so structure would change and all in all it would SUCK.

A nwod based all-splat game would be great, but frankly Promethean is a better candidate for a cardgame than requiem.

A reboot wouldnt help VTES as much as a new batch of stuff with a chunk dedicated to simpler stuff for beginners. A no-experience starter box for ~$25-30, and then some precons geared toward getting people from brand new to overcoming the learning curve without getting bored of stealthbleed or burnt out by amount of stuff.

Reboot means we lose players who dont care anymore, and gain back some flavor or the week seeking vampire niche types for like 2 months.

Self Biased, do you feel that literally any card being obtainable for very cheap would make your playgroup more interested? If proxies are what you have but real cards arent financially painful, would it increase interest?

self wrote:

my playgroup is okay with proxies/printing cards so long as they're easily recognizable.

I think this is being done in vast majority of playgroups playing their casual games.

You don't need to change the game.
At least in Portugal (don't know elsewhere) Commander is growing.
People don't mind multi-player long term games.

Hell, it's the very essence of some of the most popular types of games: board games and RPG's.

FFG (best gaming company out there at the moment) could develop and release LCG packs (like we do here, but bigger) and still we would have a secondary market for singles.
We almost always did: my best eBuys were packs of cards clearly opened in pre-cons.
Sure, FFG's prize support isn't the greatest, but their games are well developed and cheap in comparison, so have less issues for new players.

I for one would welcome our FFG overlords.

Is this getting off topic?
Sorry guys, I've been for Proxies and against Proxies (mostly after debates with my fellow Coordinators).
There's no easy answer for this.

Although I can now say that nobody that I know dropped the game here for not having money to buy Villeins or Ashurs.

The reasons were (in no specific order):
-Lack of new cards (some people think cards come in boosters and decks only. everything else is a sin to Mankind). Others think there aren't enough new toys.
-No store properly supports the game in Portugal ATM. And people here dislike buying things online, for some reason.

We'll see how things move forward (or not) in the future.

If PoD model goes through as planned, Drive-thru cards will potentially be able to offer whatever sort of project people will buy.

FFG did for sure pull out of negotiations, and did for sure release thier own vampire card game. Not a ccg, tcg, lcg, just a standalone card game with vampires. Think "Pimp the backhanding". Its got something in common with vtes, but is definately not vtes.

We lost people due to lack of cards in brick n mortar shops, less visability locally when 3 times a week vtes stuff turn into once, then i guess every other week now and not at a shop.

Some folks just got busy, and a few were mad with beimg OOP.

But, Steve Weick getting negotiations through would fix most of our problems. Brick and mortar could order if they wanted, new cards would be cards, beginner oriented stuff could be designed, etc.

ReverendRevolver wrote:

Self Biased, do you feel that literally any card being obtainable for very cheap would make your playgroup more interested? If proxies are what you have but real cards arent financially painful, would it increase interest?

the short answer is yes.

the longer answer is that the new players are content to play with the proxies in casual games and are unwilling to shell out the big bucks on the secondary market for cards for "official" tournaments.

I've got a few veteran players that are basically against paying fees to play the game in tournament formats, regardless of prize support. thy're not opposed to playing in the format, just the fee. i respect the idea, but i cannot fathom five or ten dollars being that important to principle.

Frankly, i don't see V:tes continuing in its current format. I enjoy playing the game, and i have the means to produce all the proxy cards my playgroup could ever dream of. were new cards to be made available i'd gladly buy them and support the game. I'm still working on a coherent post as to the nature of Vtes and it's merits as a CCG, but time and temulency usually work against me.

seld biased, based on what you described I don't see the (current) format being the problem with your playerbase.

I supstect that the people who are unwilling to shell out ANY kind of tournament fee won't change even if the format is changed to, well, whatever.

The newbies could, veteran players willing, loan necessary card for the tournament.