Heidelberg Timing

Jeff wrote:

TryDeflectingThisGrapple wrote:

...the part in 6.5.6 about the bloodhunt not being an action...is meant to imply that action modifiers and reactions cannot be applied to the referendum. Hence, Pascal's use of the language "outside the action" - which seems to more accurate the situation.

Perhaps "as a byproduct of the action" may be more to the meaning. Point is that it may not be appropriate to play action modifiers or reactions for votes in whatever action led to the blood hunt (e.g. Bum's Rush, Agg-poke, Amaranth), so they can't be used in the referendum.

The blood hunt referendum is defined as not being an action and therefore there cannot be an acting minion. It also must occur after a diablerie (so it is part of resolving the diablerie but is not an action and there is no current action or acting minion). So with no acting minion you cannot have action modifiers or reactions. However, it is still a referendum so other effects playable during a referendum are playable during a blood hunt.

prestonp wrote:

So you can not use Heidelberg after Spirit Marionette.

No, you precisely can use Heidelberg after Spirit Marionette. You can tap it in the "between actions" phase after Spirit Marionette and before you move on to the compulsory action.

Preston,
When it comes to Mandatory Actions, think of it as if the rules or card are telling you "You must make this action your next declared action". That means that while you aren't taking an action, you may choose to do any number of effects that are not actions. But, you later must take an action and that action must be the mandatory action and then when it is resolved, you can go on with whatever you like in your minion phase.

Also remember that a minion with multiple mandatory actions is prohibited from taking any action at all, so the mandatory actions for that minion are not done and you may go on with other actions or must go to mandatory actions on other minions (if they exist)

jamesatzephyr wrote:

prestonp wrote:

So you can not use Heidelberg after Spirit Marionette.

No, you precisely can use Heidelberg after Spirit Marionette. You can tap it in the "between actions" phase after Spirit Marionette and before you move on to the compulsory action.

Norm doesn't believe you. Can someone provide a link to an official ruling that you can use Heidelberg after the Spirit Marionette action has resolved.

20090123 used as example above somewhere, relating impulse, actions, between actions and Heidleberg.

Norm can win with redlist. Hes plainly tapping into other planes of reality. But Heidleberg isnt useable between actions. Spirit marionette is an action. The stolen chumps bleed is an action. The space between the two isnt an action. Thats the easiest way to explain it. If it all happened before marionette resolved, yoi couldnt use the castle and you could use a topdexked freakdrive on the salubri who marionetted.
But its not. Theres the carded spirit mationette at OBE and the madatory bleed action of the stolen minion, two seperate actions with impulse being passed like a frizbee, and impulse still passes back and forth in between first action ending and second starting, and when the marionetting minioms controller has impulse after marionette, they have temporary control of a chump about to madatorily bleed, and an action isnt happening then, so hiedleberg can tap, along with any other effects that are tap effects not relating to an action being declared.

It's the same reason you can have Hesha take a hunt action, then tap Heidelberg to give one of his blood to empty Lalitha before she would have to take her mandatory hunt.
Mandatory actions are just actions that must happen as the next action, but they don't change the rest of the rules.