file What exactly is "Block resolution"

28 May 2019 09:04 - 28 May 2019 09:28 #95092 by Tadori
Its my first post here so I would like to say Hello to everyone. I'm returning to VETS after a long time in torpor.

I have the following question.

I found ont VEKN.NET in General rulings this rule:

"Combat occurs as part of the block - not after the block. (So Cats' Guidance and Freak Drive are played after the combat, not before). [RTR 19980623]"

In the new print of Change of target we have this statement "Only usable if this minion is blocked, before block resolution."

So looking on those two rules. You can play change of target after block attempt is successful and blocking vampire is locked.

I know the ruling of change of target is different but in this case what "Block resolution" actually mean
Last edit: 28 May 2019 09:28 by Tadori.

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28 May 2019 09:40 - 28 May 2019 09:49 #95094 by Ankha
From the latest newsletter:

www.vekn.net/2-uncategorised/433-vampire-elder-kindred-network-newsletter-april-2019

Q: What is the "block resolution"?

A: If a minion is blocked, the block resolves by locking the blocking minion, and making the acting and blocking minion enter combat with each other. The "lock + enter combat" part is called the block resolution, and locking and entering combat happen at the same time.

Obedience is played "if this vampire is about to enter combat with an acting younger vampire" (that is, right before entering combat). If the "enter combat" is part of a block resolution (e.g., the vampire attempts to block and is about to be successful), the card is played and ends the action before the "lock + enter combat" block resolution: therefore, the blocking vampire is not locked.

Change of Target is played "if this minion is blocked, before block resolution." Since Change of Target ends the action, the block resolution never happens. Therefore, the blocking minion is not locked for blocking. (It would require explicit card text such as Mirror Walk that says: "lock the blocking minion and end the action before block resolution").

I have updated the rulebook.

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
Last edit: 28 May 2019 09:49 by Ankha.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Lönkka

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28 May 2019 10:09 #95095 by Tadori
Thanks,

But to be honest name "block resolution" is very confusing, because its indicates (as in every card game I played in 20 year) end of block action.

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28 May 2019 11:31 - 28 May 2019 11:32 #95098 by Ankha

Tadori wrote: Thanks,

But to be honest name "block resolution" is very confusing, because its indicates (as in every card game I played in 20 year) end of block action.

"Action resolution" is not the end of the action. "Block resolution" is not the end of the block. Unless you mean "after xxx resolution"?
What other games are you referring to?

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
Last edit: 28 May 2019 11:32 by Ankha.

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28 May 2019 12:38 - 28 May 2019 14:38 #95099 by Tadori

Ankha wrote:

Tadori wrote: Thanks,

But to be honest name "block resolution" is very confusing, because its indicates (as in every card game I played in 20 year) end of block action.

"Action resolution" is not the end of the action. "Block resolution" is not the end of the block. Unless you mean "after xxx resolution"?
What other games are you referring to?


Hi This are examples form MTG

304.2. When an instant spell resolves, the actions stated in its rules text are followed. Then it’s put into its owner’s graveyard

When a sorcery spell resolves, the actions stated in its rules text are followed. Then it’s put into its owner’s graveyard


So resolution in MTG means you have to play an interrupt before resolution(you build stack) and reaction after resolution

This is from L5R

Each time a triggering condition occurs, the following sequence is followed: (1) execute any interrupts to that triggering condition, (2) resolve the triggering condition itself, and then, (3) execute any reactions to that triggering condition.

So looking at this examples. you have sequence of action.

1 play interparts (before [action] happens)
2 action resolution
3.reactions (after [action] happens)

So in our example our action is Block

Its starts with announcing block attempted(you can play interrupts), then we resolve "block" and the combat is the part of block action.When the combat ends Block segment resolves.(you can play reactions cards)

I understand your explanation and its ok. but the wording itself is a little not intuitive

Maybe "Before Block attempt resolution" would be bether. Then you have:

1.Block Action:
1.1 declare block attempt
1.1.1 Play Stealth/Intercept modifiers and card before “block attempt resolution” (action window)
1.2 Block attempt resolution (lock + begin combat)
1.3 combat
1.4 Block action resolution
Last edit: 28 May 2019 14:38 by Tadori.

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29 May 2019 10:30 - 29 May 2019 10:31 #95118 by Ankha

Tadori wrote: So looking at this examples. you have sequence of action.

1 play interparts (before [action] happens)
2 action resolution
3.reactions (after [action] happens)

So in our example our action is Block

Its starts with announcing block attempted(you can play interrupts), then we resolve "block" and the combat is the part of block action.When the combat ends Block segment resolves.(you can play reactions cards)


Block attempts are not part of the block resolution.
Announcing the action, playing cards as the action is played, attempting to block etc. are not part of the action resolution.

Tadori wrote: I understand your explanation and its ok. but the wording itself is a little not intuitive

Maybe "Before Block attempt resolution" would be bether. Then you have:

1.Block Action:
1.1 declare block attempt
1.1.1 Play Stealth/Intercept modifiers and card before “block attempt resolution” (action window)
1.2 Block attempt resolution (lock + begin combat)
1.3 combat
1.4 Block action resolution

In VTES, "resolution" means the same as in other games, that is "304.2. When <here action card> resolves, the actions stated in its rules text are followed. Then it’s put into its owner’s graveyard"

The (very) basic summary of an action is:

1/ declare the action and lock the minion
2/ play cards "as the action is announced"
3/ play action modifiers / reaction cards and declare block attempts

If the action is not blocked:
3'/ play more action modifiers / reaction cards
4/ resolve the action successfully ("action resolution")

If the action is blocked:
4/ resolve the action unsuccessfully => resolve the block ("block resolution")

Then in both case:
5/ play cards "after action resolution"

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
Last edit: 29 May 2019 10:31 by Ankha.

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