file Can you use Bollix [tha] as defense against long range strike?

01 Sep 2016 19:57 - 01 Sep 2016 20:04 #78102 by BogusMagus
Hello, I have a question.

Can a vampire play
Bollix [tha]
at long range to protect him/herself from a Gun strike?

Bollix
Type: Combat
Requires: anarch Celerity/Presence/Thaumaturgy
Requires an anarch.
[cel] Maneuver or press.
[ pre] Cancel the opposing minion's aim, frenzy, or grapple card as it is played, and its cost is not paid.
[tha] Strike: hand strike at +1 damage. This damage cannot be prevented by cards requiring Fortitude [for]. The opposing vampire's strikes with weapons inflict no damage on this vampire this round.
Last edit: 01 Sep 2016 20:04 by BogusMagus.

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02 Sep 2016 13:18 #78112 by GreyB

Hello, I have a question.

Can a vampire play
Bollix [tha]
at long range to protect him/herself from a Gun strike?


Bollix
Type: Combat
Requires: anarch Celerity/Presence/Thaumaturgy
Requires an anarch.
[cel] Maneuver or press.
[ pre] Cancel the opposing minion's aim, frenzy, or grapple card as it is played, and its cost is not paid.
[tha] Strike: hand strike at +1 damage. This damage cannot be prevented by cards requiring Fortitude [for]. The opposing vampire's strikes with weapons inflict no damage on this vampire this round.


no.

The whole text of :tha: is part of the strike. If in this case the strike does not hit the opposing minion, it's (extra) effect is negated.

:garg: :VIS: :POT: :FOR: :flight: -1 Strength
The following user(s) said Thank You: BogusMagus

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03 Sep 2016 16:10 #78123 by BogusMagus
Thank you very much, GreyB-san!

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16 Sep 2016 13:13 #78327 by XZealot

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16 Sep 2016 13:39 #78334 by jamesatzephyr

Of course you can


Could you provide any backing for that?

Soul Burn, for example, has similar text to Bollix:
Strike: 1R damage. This damage cannot be prevented by cards that require Fortitude [for] . If the opposing vampire attempts to strike with a weapon this round, he or she does no damage.

The anti-weapon clause is ineffective if dodged.


[LSJ 20040929]

> 2. If soul burn is dodged, does the "weapon inflict no damage" thing
> take effect or not ? (i believe not)

"Not" is correct. Dodge protects the dodger from all effects of the
strike.



Since the anti-weapon text of Soul Burn is part of the strike affecting the opponent, the anti-weapon text of Bollix is also part of the strike affecting the opponent.

Then, since Bollix isn't a ranged strike, it doesn't take effect at close range. 6.4.3: "Unless the strike is identified as ranged or does "R" damage (or is a defensive strike such as dodge or combat ends), it is only effective at close range."

(Dodge and Combat Ends are explicitly said to be effective at any range, 6.4.5.)

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18 Sep 2016 12:42 #78363 by XZealot
Dodge specifically is ruled in the rulebook

Dodge. A dodge strike deals no damage, but it protects the dodging minion and his possessions (cards on him) from the effects of the opposing strike. Retainers are not protected, however. A dodge is effective at any range. A dodge protects even from the effects of a strike done with first strike. (A dodge is a strike, even though it is solely defensive. It represents the activity of the minion during that pair of strikes.)

There is no such ruling for short range strikes being used at long range.

It is actually on you to prove that the defensive part of the card is negated by being at long range, which it is not.

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