Forcing Methuselah to play cards you cannot play
Example case:
Ingrid Rossler plays a Parity Shift. Omaya tries to block and eventually plays an Eyes of Argus for +2 intercept on inferior. Another Methuselah notices after the card is played that Parity Shift is in fact an undirected action. Omaya tries to cancel the playing of card because playing it for intended effect wasn't allowed, but Ingrid Rossler says that the card should be played on superior as a wake on Devin Bisley instead.
Name: Devin Bisley
[Sabbat:V, SW:U/PT]
Cardtype: Vampire
Clan: Tzimisce
Group: 2
Capacity: 5
Discipline: vic ANI AUS
Sabbat.
Artist: Karl Waller
Name: Ingrid Rossler
[DS:V, Anarchs:PG]
Cardtype: Vampire
Clan: Gangrel
Group: 2
Capacity: 9
Discipline: dom ANI FOR PRO
Camarilla Prince of Geneva: If Ingrid is ready at the start of your influence phase, you get +2 transfers.
Artist: Ron Spencer
Name: Omaya
[SW:C]
Cardtype: Vampire
Clan: Gangrel antitribu
Group: 2
Capacity: 7
Discipline: pro ANI AUS FOR
Sabbat: Omaya may prevent one damage each combat.
Artist: Mike Danza
Name: Eyes of Argus
[KoT:C/B2, HttB:PSal3, Anthology:4]
Cardtype: Reaction
Discipline: Auspex
[aus] Only usable during a

[AUS] Only usable by a locked vampire. This vampire wakes (they can play reaction cards and attempt to block even though locked until the current action is concluded).
Artist: Heather Kreiter
Edit: Current general rulings on Playing cards
Playing Cards:
If a card targets (chooses, selects, is played on, etc.) some target, then the card can only be played if an appropriate target is available. Examples: Strike: Steal/Destroy Equipment/Weapon cannot be used if the opposing minion doesn't have a suitable Equipment/Weapon to be destroyed/stolen. [RTR 19980928] [LSJ 20030408]ÂÂ "Stealing blood" effects target a minion, not its blood (or life) counters.
You cannot play a card whose cost cannot be paid. If, between the time a action card is played (or an action is attempted) and the time the cost of the action is paid, you no longer can pay the cost, then you pay as much as you can and the card is burned without effect (or the action has no effect). [TOM 19960514] [RTR 20010710]
A card can be canceled "as it is played" (with Sudden Reversal, Direct Intervention, etc.) only as it is played. The only cards that can be played "as" another one is played are the ones the players have in their hands at the time. You cannot use the Barrens after a master card is played, for example, to attempt to draw into a Sudden Reversal to cancel it. [RTR 20040501]
An effect that allows a minion to play a card that requires a Discipline he doesn't have (e.g., Infernal Familiar, Ian Forestal) can be used to meet one (not both) of the normal Discipline requirements of a multi-Discipline card. [LSJ 20011217]
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- Khalid1988
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- Ancilla
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Making Devin play it would be up to.a judge, because your example has that minion, and under certain circumstances (about to be ousted if you dont draw intercept) cycling the card may be optimal.
I've played Kiss of Ra at inferior during a tournament. Started as an oops, but the Ravnos blocking me was at 3 blood, and week of nightmares was in play, about to pop. So, she went to torpor eventually, and the player I did it to (Cashdollar) still brings it up because, you know, I played Kiss of Ra at

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- ReverendRevolver
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- Antediluvian
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In a tournament, it's a warning. You showed a part of your hand in a manner not part of a card effect requiring you to.
Making Devin play it would be up to.a judge, because your example has that minion, and under certain circumstances (about to be ousted if you dont draw intercept) cycling the card may be optimal.
I've played Kiss of Ra at inferior during a tournament. Started as an oops, but the Ravnos blocking me was at 3 blood, and week of nightmares was in play, about to pop. So, she went to torpor eventually, and the player I did it to (Cashdollar) still brings it up because, you know, I played Kiss of Ra at
Is not problem if him can cycling or not,is problem so him play card by one minion and replace card,after that we will see Omaya cant play eyes,so what now? him can take card back in hand or if posible must chose other target in play(in this example Devin)?
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- beslin igor
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Since it is not legal, the juge must proceed to a rollback. Considering that Omaya could play the card at a different level is not a rollback.
The player should get a penalty following the penalty guide.
Now, in a different situation where Devin is locked. Devin's controller plays a On the Qui Vive, then plays Eyes of Argus saying "Eyes of Argus". In that case, Devin's controller is making a mistake since he doesn't indicate whether the card is played at inferior at superior. Since Devin can play it only at superior, the judge shouldn't allow a rollback.
If Devin's controller, under On the Qui Vive, had said "+2 intercept" while playing Eyes of Argus, then the judge must proceed to a rollback since the card was implicitly played at inferior, which is not legal.
Of course, again, the player should get a penalty following the penalty guide either for not properly announcing the level of the cards he plays, or because he's doing illegal things.
In the event the player has replaced the card and the judge must rollback, the judge must estimate whether that knowledge gives an important advantage to the player (eg., the next card is a Delaying Tactics, cycling an useless wake allows to draw it), or not, and take measures (eg., shuffling the library)
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- first, it was on Lackey, so if I recall you just played the card without announcing anything. Sure you meant it as a +2 Intercept, but that isn't said when the card hits the table. So in that case what would you do Ankha ?
- depending on the cards, the annoucements, the judge etc, it would be ruled either way, and I've seen it ruled differently in tournaments. I think we really need clearer guidelines for tournament rules.
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Even on Lackey, when you play a card, you have to tell what you do with it, for instance "+2 intercept", and who plays it.Ok, so :
- first, it was on Lackey, so if I recall you just played the card without announcing anything. Sure you meant it as a +2 Intercept, but that isn't said when the card hits the table. So in that case what would you do Ankha ?
Otherwise, players must ask how the card is played/who plays it. Then you rule in consequence.
Indeed.- depending on the cards, the annoucements, the judge etc, it would be ruled either way, and I've seen it ruled differently in tournaments. I think we really need clearer guidelines for tournament rules.
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