List of cards to ban

elotar wrote:

Here we got attitude "bleed is boring", so you r not often bled even once per turn. So you got nothing by staying untapped. Also I think everywhere majority of redirects are played with wakes, so you r already tapped.

Yeah, see, this right here is a problem. It doesn't help your case of things being needed to be banned when you apparently play in an environment that is vastly different than most people play in. I mean, you guys can play however you want, and more power to you. But if you are playing in an environment where people don't bleed much? You are playing a completely different game than the vast majority of the VTES playing public. And as a result, your views on what is or is not appropriate for the game is, well, suspect.

elotar wrote:

PS: I'm now even thinking to make small caps with villeins, got this idea when writing this post.

This has been done.

Check out John Bell's To the Death! No! To the Pain .

And just to throw in my 2:blood:, I am also part of the camp that thinks that there's a place for MT and Villein in the casual play and tournament scenes nowadays.

elotar wrote:

Unfortunately, by being a trifle, which, generally, means "free", it also walpapered mostly all other blood management options for mid+ cap vamps.

Trifle does not mean "free" (not generally nor specific). It still uses up a card slot. You cannot simply add up trifles in your decks for good just because you get another master phase. If you had a horrible master card jam before you know what I mean. Second your playgroup seems to not like Sudden Reversal. Forget about all sweet trifleness if you eat one .

As written before Blood Dolls are still a very good way of getting blood back from Vampires AND gives you the ability to use it for other purposes if needed. = Big advantage. Vessel is not that good as BB, but still good enough regarding its hosing ability and the good synergy with Jake W. Villein is very good for big caps. But your argument "Villein" wallpapers mostly all other blood management options for mid+ cap vamps is not true afais.

Played today my CEL-guns with villeins. Works great.

In regards to Pentex(TM) Subversion. i find that if it gets played when you only have 1 minion ready and can't another out. Then its up to cross table talking and if your ally can't/won't help you then you are just a free vp sitting there. Also if they do consider it because it is at 0s then without any sort of stealth boosting it will get blocked.

The way I would consider changing it is the action +1s at base and/or allow the minion to attempt to remove it themselves

Either one allow a bit more freedom other then a complete lockdown which can really hose someone.

All in all though that is just my 2 blood.

Lazoth wrote:

In regards to Pentex(TM) Subversion. i find that if it gets played when you only have 1 minion ready and can't another out.

If you only have 1 minion and can't influence another one, you are already in a pretty bad position. Sure, Pentex can screw you in that case, but so does any block denial. The problem is not Pentex, it is how you ended up with only 1 minion.

Then its up to cross table talking and if your ally can't/won't help you then you are just a free vp sitting there.

1) Most of the time it isn't about cross table talking, because you will be ousted in the turn Pentex is played

2) You can still play bleed bounce and Delaying Tactics under Pentex. Assuming you survive the turn, you can also empty/Golconda your vampire. Far from a free VP.

Also if they do consider it because it is at 0s then without any sort of stealth boosting it will get blocked.

Apart maybe from some very dedicated walls like a weenie , any decent deck has an answer to this, if only because anyone wants to bleed at some point. Whether they force their actions through with stealth, blok denial, bruise, swarm, ... does not really matter.

Don't forget Pentex costs 2 pool. If your predator fails to oust you in the turn he plays Pentex, he often puts himself in danger. If he can block a cross table Pentex destruction and resist his own predator, he is not stealing his VP, Pentex or not.