question-circle Proxies after 05/2018

14 May 2018 20:00 - 14 May 2018 20:06 #86899 by KzArashi
Replied by KzArashi on topic Proxies after 05/2018

The post before yours was from the thriving playerbase in Brazil who are currently the most screwed in the distribution pipeline. Proxies could negatively impact sales and thus hurt our game commercially. All proxies and PDF cards should be eliminated, but on a time table to keep up with printing and distribution of vekn sets and reprints.


As I said before, in another post, people from Rio de Janeiro playground have some reservation about the shipping costs to the new kits. But no one would argue against reservation on the use of proxies.
Is a logical consensus that if the game is back on production, the use of real cards must be encouraged.

proxy-cards would have to be inserted in an opaque sleeve (along the rest of the crypt and/or library), before a regular VTES card.
Otherwise, the use of proxy cards is not permitted, unless a judge provides these


Other concern of mine is that not everyone follow that "proxy-cards" rulings. And I believe that in the cases it occurs, there isn't bad intentions, only the desire to get a better looking on your decks. But the fact that some player use proxies with quality that ressemble "industrial printing", card back included, must be of some risk to the comercial sucess of the game.

How would a newbie aknowledge if a card is for real or a good quality print proxy?

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Last edit: 14 May 2018 20:06 by KzArashi.

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15 May 2018 08:41 #86912 by Lönkka
Replied by Lönkka on topic Proxies after 05/2018
Printing your cards with cardstock and proper backs is not making proxies.
It is counterfeiting.

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15 May 2018 10:20 #86914 by Bloodartist
Replied by Bloodartist on topic Proxies after 05/2018

Printing your cards with cardstock and proper backs is not making proxies.
It is counterfeiting.


^

This right here.

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15 May 2018 10:30 - 15 May 2018 10:32 #86918 by Kraus
Replied by Kraus on topic Proxies after 05/2018

Printing your cards with cardstock and proper backs is not making proxies.
It is counterfeiting.

Furthermore, the rules for proxies are very explicit. It's a paper print. There's no way anyone could mistake them for real cards if done according to the rules.

While proxy tournaments do for sure hurt the commercial aspect of the game, namely White Wolf and Black Chantry, the fact that you could start playing with proxies has netted us new players. Much needed ones to boot. For the GAME the availability of any strategy to try out for any player has been one of the best things.

Of course legal proxies can't be a thing forever, but I just can't agree with that they should be banned "as soon as possible". They should be made illegal only when there's a new, affordable and stable way to get into the game from a box from the shelves of your local game store. Don't rush it.

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Last edit: 15 May 2018 10:32 by Kraus.

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15 May 2018 23:21 - 15 May 2018 23:23 #86937 by manituan
Replied by manituan on topic Proxies after 05/2018
I just wanted to mention that I've never played VTES using proxies. I'd rather buy the cards. But proxies will be neccessary for a while if you want new/old people to access the game and all its different arquetipes. I'd rather see new people playing with proxies than not seeing them playing at all. My question was based on a complete ignorance on the matter.

Also, I don't see a difference between a proxy and conterfeiting if it's for personal use. That's just my opinion.
Last edit: 15 May 2018 23:23 by manituan.

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16 May 2018 04:54 #86941 by Ke.
Replied by Ke. on topic Proxies after 05/2018

I'd rather see new people playing with proxies than not seeing them playing at all. My question was based on a complete ignorance on the matter.


We wouldn't have a play group if the group didn't have the ability to play with proxy cards casually. I suspect that's the case in the other major city here in our little country (NZ).

I like the idea of proxies not being allowed for tournaments — but only once a greater range of stock is widely available. The local Pokemon store takes a similar approach; proxies / prints are fine for casual games — real cards are required for events. I'm not sure a blanket ban would encourage a growing player base. Proxying gives people a chance to try things before committing.

I REALLY like the idea of just ordering my deck and it arriving in the post ready to play — I would pay good money for this as it would save me a lot of time and hassle. Currently it is easier for me to print and play as opposed to searching 70,000 cards for the cards required for a deck. I'd rather keep ordering new decks — a perpetual revenue stream.

Our new players really like the idea of playing with actual cards and as accessibility improves no doubt they will be. Providing the end product is of a higher quality and provides a better service; then the people who can pay for it will.

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