question-circle Withering and first strike

13 Apr 2012 12:16 - 13 Apr 2012 12:22 #27816 by Louhi
My guess would be that you are allowed to 'play' the aid from bats in both cases (as a maneuver + strike that is) but the immortal grapple will limit your 'use' of it after it's played. The withering, once resolved, would only restricts the playing of the card.

Lidingö Scourge
Last edit: 13 Apr 2012 12:22 by Louhi. Reason: clarification

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13 Apr 2012 12:19 #27817 by Pascal Bertrand

This ruling is a bit illogical for me. I explain.

I play an aid from the bat, but my opponent play Immortal grapple. At strike resolution, I can't play the Aid, so I have no strike.

I play an aid from the bat, but my opponent play Withering strike with first strike. At strike resolution, my Aid from the bat is resolved anyway.

In a pure logical sense, I must admit having an hard time to see this as making sense. (also, it screw further first strike, which is already not the sexiest effect on earth)

Withering allows you to declare strikes. Immortal Grapple forbids some strike declaration.

See also: You can play Burning Wrath with Immortal Grapple or Withering. It has nothing to do with the fact that Burning Wrath / Aid from Bats requires a discipline. What matters is when the effects of a card apply.
For non-strike (and non-action) cards, they resolve as the card is played.
For strike cards, the strike is resolved during the strike resolution, which happens after the strike declaration.
Immortal Grapple affects strike declaration. Withering doesn't.

Why is it illogical that two cards with different texts have different effects?

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13 Apr 2012 18:36 #27846 by AaronC

My guess would be that you are allowed to 'play' the aid from bats in both cases (as a maneuver + strike that is) but the immortal grapple will limit your 'use' of it after it's played. The withering, once resolved, would only restricts the playing of the card.


That's right. Aid from Bats is "played" when you use the maneuver, assuming we're talking about when the optional maneuver is used. The strike from Aid from Bats is "declared" during strike declaration.

The Aid from Bats card is already played and in the ash heap during strike declaration (again, assuming you've used the optional maneuver), meaning it isn't affected by the Withering.

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