file Wake cards during the "as play" window and other exotic cancelling effects

10 Aug 2021 12:22 - 10 Aug 2021 12:31 #102882 by Timo
Here is what the rulebook says about the wake cards during the "as play" window

Wake: A vampire that wakes during an action can attempt to block that action and/ or play reaction cards as though unlocked for the duration of the action. Wake effects can always be played during the “as a card is played” window, in order to play other reaction cards that must be played in that window. A reaction card that unlocks a vampire but does not wake it is not considered as a wake effect and cannot be played during the “as a card is played” window.

My question is :
am I allowed to play a wake card during the "as play" window just for cycling or do I need to have a card to play in order to do so ?

My other question is :
does "treat the sick mind" can be played to cancel a combat card placed on an acting vampire I control in combat (for example a disarm)

Name: Treat the Sick Mind
[HttB:R]
Cardtype: Action/Reaction
Discipline: Obeah/Dementation
[dem] [ACTION] Unlock an ally or younger vampire.
[obe] As [dem] above, with +1 stealth.
[OBE] [REACTION] Cancel a card played by another Methuselah that would be placed on a vampire with Dementation [dem] he or she does not control. Usable even if there is no action.
Artist: Mathias Kollros

Edit : my second question could be more generic :
Can the card cancel any kind of card in any kind of situation ? (and specifically while my vampire is acting/in combat).
Last edit: 10 Aug 2021 12:31 by Timo.

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10 Aug 2021 15:56 #102883 by Yomyael
I can't answer the first question. However for the second question, from the rulebook:

Reaction cards: A ready unlocked minion can play a reaction card in response to an action taken by a minion controlled by another Methuselah.

Since reaction cards can be played only during an action taken by a minion controlled by another methuselah, the answer is you cannot if you control the acting minion. You can only do it when another player controlls the acting minion, or by card text when there is no action.

Prince of Bonn, Germany

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10 Aug 2021 17:35 - 11 Aug 2021 22:21 #102886 by Bloodartist

My question is :
am I allowed to play a wake card during the "as play" window just for cycling or do I need to have a card to play in order to do so ?

The former. You don't need another card. 

A heretic is a man who sees with his own eyes.
—Gotthold Ephraim Lessing



Last edit: 11 Aug 2021 22:21 by Bloodartist.

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17 Aug 2021 15:31 #102929 by Timo

My question is :
am I allowed to play a wake card during the "as play" window just for cycling or do I need to have a card to play in order to do so ?

The former. You don't need another card. 

So I should be allowed to play a wake anytime a card is played even during my turn, even when in combat etc...

Or not ?

Ankha ?

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17 Aug 2021 18:27 - 19 Aug 2021 06:14 #102931 by Ankha
They are still reaction cards, so you can't play them during your own actions, nor in combat, nor when there is no action.

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
Last edit: 19 Aug 2021 06:14 by Ankha.

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17 Aug 2021 18:37 - 17 Aug 2021 22:11 #102932 by inm8

Timo wrote:
So I should be allowed to play a wake anytime a card is played

No, wakes are normally reaction card effects which would limit it to only be useable as a response to an action being taken (including card-less actions) but not as a response to a master card, etc. (see rulebook www.vekn.net/rulebook#summary-of-the-course-of-an-action)

SUMMARY OF THE COURSE OF AN ACTION
Action modifiers
 and reaction cards can be played at any time before resolution during an action, with the acting Methuselah getting the opportunity to play first. 

Timo wrote:

even during my turn,


Wakes normally being reaction card effects cannot be played during your own turn minion’s action as per the rules (see rulebook www.vekn.net/rulebook#summary-of-the-course-of-an-action). Could be played on your own turn by your ready unlocked minion in the event that your turn is interrupted by another Methuselah having a minion taking an action with the help of for ex. Enkil Cog

SUMMARY OF THE COURSE OF AN ACTION
Only the acting minion can play action modifiers, while only other Methuselahs’ ready unlocked minions can play reaction cards.

Timo wrote:

even when in combat etc...

During combat only combat cards are allowed to be played regardless whos turn it is as per the rules (see rulebook www.vekn.net/rulebook#combat)

Combat
Note: The only cards that can be played during combat are combat cards.

In terms of the card text of Treat the Sick Mind when it says "Usable even if there is no action." it would be interesting to get an example of when that could be used or a confirmation that it means that this reaction ignores the limitation of only being useable as a response to an action being taken and can be played against for ex a master card being placed on a vampire with dementation (or a combat card as per one of the original questions).
Last edit: 17 Aug 2021 22:11 by inm8. Reason: Correcting error that reactions cannot be played during your own turn

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