file Mind Rape + Descent into Darkness (again)

09 Jul 2024 12:35 #111982 by Coyote
@Ankha

Could you clarify this point? Thanks.

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14 Jul 2024 17:07 #112024 by Ankha
Yes, this is an issue. It should read (errata):

Name: Descent into Darkness
[Gehenna:C, POD:DTC]
Cardtype: Action
Cost: 1 blood
Discipline: Obtenebration
+1 stealth action.
[obt] Put this card on this vampire, then put this vampire and any other cards and counters on them out of play (breaking any temporary control effects; this card remains in play). During your influence phase, this vampire can gain 2 blood, and you can choose to burn this card to return the vampire to play (in the same region as they were before), locked.
[OBT] As above, but the vampire is unlocked as they return to play.

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
The following user(s) said Thank You: Coyote

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15 Jul 2024 07:17 #112030 by Coyote
Thanks Ankha

As a judge, I have now a doubt.
If I find this issue in a tournament and the text is still not corrected in the card list, how should I proceed?

If I stick to the rules, I should rule according to the actual text from the card list (and allowing this issue).

I know this is an extremely rare case, but I am thinking in a more general view. I understand the card list from VEKN is official to rule changes, updates and erratas from cards.

So if a card is errated but still not corrected in the card list (like it is Descent now) I understand that I should still rule using the official text.

Correct?

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15 Jul 2024 07:27 - 15 Jul 2024 13:55 #112031 by Coyote
And to make it shorter, I would delete the part of "and any other cards and counters on them". Cards and counters on a card out of play are implicitly out of play. So this line is almost redundant.

"this card remains in play" is enough to override the general rule.

It just my opinion.

Name: Descent into Darkness
[Gehenna:C, POD:DTC]
Cardtype: Action
Cost: 1 blood
Discipline: Obtenebration
+1 stealth action.
[obt] Put this card on this vampire, then put this vampire and any other cards and counters on them out of play (breaking any temporary control effects; this card remains in play). During your influence phase, this vampire can gain 2 blood, and you can choose to burn this card to return the vampire to play (in the same region as they were before), locked.
[OBT] As above, but the vampire is unlocked as they return to play.
Last edit: 15 Jul 2024 13:55 by Coyote.

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15 Jul 2024 17:51 #112036 by kschaefer

Yes, this is an issue. It should read (errata):

Name: Descent into Darkness
[Gehenna:C, POD:DTC]
Cardtype: Action
Cost: 1 blood
Discipline: Obtenebration
+1 stealth action.
[obt] Put this card on this vampire, then put this vampire and any other cards and counters on them out of play (breaking any temporary control effects; this card remains in play). During your influence phase, this vampire can gain 2 blood, and you can choose to burn this card to return the vampire to play (in the same region as they were before), locked.
[OBT] As above, but the vampire is unlocked as they return to play.


To be clear: this errata was issued on July 14, 2024 and therefore goes into effect August 13, 2024, correct?

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15 Jul 2024 21:39 #112041 by Ankha

Yes, this is an issue. It should read (errata):

Name: Descent into Darkness
[Gehenna:C, POD:DTC]
Cardtype: Action
Cost: 1 blood
Discipline: Obtenebration
+1 stealth action.
[obt] Put this card on this vampire, then put this vampire and any other cards and counters on them out of play (breaking any temporary control effects; this card remains in play). During your influence phase, this vampire can gain 2 blood, and you can choose to burn this card to return the vampire to play (in the same region as they were before), locked.
[OBT] As above, but the vampire is unlocked as they return to play.


To be clear: this errata was issued on July 14, 2024 and therefore goes into effect August 13, 2024, correct?


Since it's the correction of an error on the printed version (rather than a new effect), it takes effect as soon as the official list is updated (which should be done in the next days).

Thanks Ankha

As a judge, I have now a doubt.
If I find this issue in a tournament and the text is still not corrected in the card list, how should I proceed?

If I stick to the rules, I should rule according to the actual text from the card list (and allowing this issue).

I know this is an extremely rare case, but I am thinking in a more general view. I understand the card list from VEKN is official to rule changes, updates and erratas from cards.

So if a card is errated but still not corrected in the card list (like it is Descent now) I understand that I should still rule using the official text.

Correct?

Correct.

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
The following user(s) said Thank You: Coyote

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