question-circle HELP with brujah debate deck

20 Sep 2018 05:00 - 20 Sep 2018 07:33 #90678 by rockman
hey guys, years ago i saw a deck that caught my attention a lot. it was a brujah deck with rake and volker as the main vampires plus other winie cript (yuri, vasilis, uma, lupo, hector sosa, blackcat, angel) and it runs with brujah debate + first traditions.

i just dusted off my cards and realized that i got the cript, many brujah debates, praxis, and some brujah master cards. the thing is that i lost tracking of the original deck, and now I don't know how to finish it. has anyone seen or built this deck?

I leave you the crads i got till now:

Crypt [12 vampires]

3 Rake brujah Prince PRES cel pot aus
2 volker brujah Prince pot CEL
1 Yuri the talon brujah cel pot pres
1 vasilis the traitor of don cruez brujah pres
1 uma hatch brujah pres cel
1 lupo pot
1 hector sosa POT pres
1 black cat pot CEL pres
1 angel cel

library: (pending to define)

master:

6 brujah debate (i know there should be at least 10)
1 carthage remembered
1 new carthage (there should be 2 of them?)
1 traditionalist
2 perfectionist
2 elysium: the arboretum
2 warzone hunting ground
1 krcg news radio
1 oxford university, England
3 presence
2 blood doll

Action:

0Third Tradition Progeny (how many should be ok?)
2 kine resources contested (I believe 8 should work)
8 conservative agitation (i know 2 or 3 would be enough)
2 command of the harpies (I should go for at least 4 to control votes)
1disputed territory
1justicar retribution
6 consanguineous boon
1 brujah justicar
1 praxis seizure: rome
1 praxis seizure: Atlanta
1 praxis seizure: barcelona
1 praxis seizure: Miami
1 praxis seizure: houston
1 praxis seizure: washington, DC
1 praxis seizure: Chicago (I know there should be at least 6 more praxis of more cities)
1 rumors of gehenna
5 The fourth tradition: The accounting
1 first tradition: the masquerade
3 enchant kindred (maybe i should go with more enchant kindred instead of using the fourth traditions)

Action Modifier:

6 bewitching oration
6 voter captivation

Reactions:

3 second tradition: domain (there should be 6 at least?)
2 legacy of power

combat:

3 staredown
3 majesty

Retainer:

1 mr wintrop

Equipment:

4 sport bike

as you may have noticed i'm very confused on what to leave or what to add to this deck. Also I know it seems a mess! i'm thinking to drop the fourth traditions and put more enchant kindred, also i believe there should be more kine resources contested (at least 6). Suggestions would be really appreciated guys. thanks in advance :)
Last edit: 20 Sep 2018 07:33 by rockman. Reason: just trying to put everything in the common format here :)

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20 Sep 2018 06:01 #90679 by kschaefer
It'd really help to comment on this deck if you could put it into "standard" format and separate cards by type and show type quantities. Either Secret Library or Amaranth text format will do this for you. It will be much easier to discern ratios and provide feedback.

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20 Sep 2018 06:21 - 20 Sep 2018 07:35 #90680 by rockman
thanks man. i'm a new guy here :D. I will put it into the standard format :D.
Last edit: 20 Sep 2018 07:35 by rockman.

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20 Sep 2018 13:43 - 20 Sep 2018 13:47 #90688 by Borrelstein
Brujah debate is certainly fun to play!
Just some ideas to make this more workable:
- if you really want to play so many masters, better add a few copies of Parthenon - consider Ashur Tables to make the deck compact 60-70 cards.
- way too many action cards: pick an angle
- some casual blocking is good, but Con Boon is what keeps you alive and pays for the 1st trads
- Deck needs cycling tech to get what you need in time (Dreams of the Sphinx, Wider view, Effective Management come to mind)
- Presence angle may be hard to use with only a few vampires that can use it: consider dropping (except perhaps some vote push, but remember Rake gets no actions once the first Brujah Debate is on the table)
- In order to get vote lock, I find adding 2-3 Haven Uncovered very useful
- making baby vampires is also pretty strong for Brujah debate with Con Boons
Last edit: 20 Sep 2018 13:47 by Borrelstein.

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20 Sep 2018 14:30 #90690 by Walt
Replied by Walt on topic HELP with brujah debate deck
On this page

www.vekn.fr/decks/twd.htm

you can find many decks that win a tournament since 1997 and a few of them are Brujah Debate decks

just search the page for "debate" and you'll find a lot of ideas

Stefano "Walt" Calzighetti
Prince of Pordenone (Italy)

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20 Sep 2018 15:24 - 20 Sep 2018 15:57 #90691 by ReverendRevolver
Here's a link to the Secret Library page listing all decks containing Brujah Debate.

www.secretlibrary.info/index.php?deck=l340

Yellow symbol means they've won a tournament.

Your master mix has too many archetype cards, and the Arboretum isn't good. Only run one of the hunting ground.

The typically effective versions (which are often thinned down to less than 80 cards, several at 60) focus on voting via numerous standing titles and keeping alive via parity shift and con boon. Then blocks with second trad, and utilizing varying degrees of combat as block deterrence and aggressive blocking.

Debate taps someone and gives all +1 strength and a manuever. It's not unique, I'd reccomend 6-9. Cathage part 1 gives your princes and justicar +1 stealth bleeding. Also not unique. Carthage part 2 gives all titled Brujah +1 bleed, and is unique.
You seem to be putting in avoidant combat and a focus on :pre: with vote pump as well as the best political action modifier in the game, voter cap. While I understand BO and VC, building a deck around expendable minions that punch for 3 ish due to a master you say your aiming for 10 copies of does not coincide with striking to end combat.

You want at least taste of vitae, and can afford in some variants up to a 20-something card combat package, the most effective are just taste, disarm, and maybe grapples, the elaborate ones add :cel: stuff.

Or, a Carthage minus debates deck where you avoid combat.

In debate, you block to protect your resources on the table and not die, then pad your pool with p-shift and votes. Your vote package should be p shift, KRC, con boons, praxis seizures, removing things that dont gain pool, remove pool, or both that aren't gonna make princes. Also, justicar ,PS rome, and maybe 3 others should do it for title awarding votes.
Drop sport bikes, add one carlton. Legacy of power can go, add on the qui vive and more second trad (you will be blocking with Rake often) I'd say 6 second trad is ok ish.
If you really want :pre: the BO and VC are ok, as are iron glare for this.

I hope Ives helped
Last edit: 20 Sep 2018 15:57 by ReverendRevolver.
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