[SUBMISSION] Slab of Steel

Conceptually, the vampire is picking up a huge slab of steel and using it to block. If they are strong enough (superior potence), hitting this with your hands is akin to running yourself into a steel wall (or shooting at one and suffering ricochet damage). A weenie potence vampire drops the slab when they are done blocking with it. A superior potence vampire has enough strength remaining to fling it at the opposing minion (or can even just lug it around with him and fling it at another minion later in the game).

Let's compare against some common combat archetypes and see how it stacks up:

.44 deck using 0-blood celerity cards (Pursuit, Psyche):
Opposing minion goes long and shoots for 2, additional strike with Pursuit for 2 more.
Potence vamp responds with Slab of Steel -- it prevents 3 during the round so he takes only one damage during the 2nd strike resolution. At superior the opposing minion takes 1 ricochet damage (environmental). So it's 1 to 1. The other vamp had a gun (already or concealed) while you did not, you both played 1 card each and you both take 1 damage. Pretty good for you. If you are a POT CEL vamp, you can cash in your own additional strikes and retaliate with the Slab. If they Psyche! you can play another Slab of Steel to achieve the same result, or you can throw your Slab at them, so you both do 2R during the initial strike phase of the new combat.
You -1 + your card in play, them -1
OR with them playing Psyche!
You -3, them -3
So it ties against basic guns at range.

Bats and Crows
They go long and you are taking 3 damage. You prevent all 3. They press and you are taking 3 more damage, you can hit back for 2R. They played 2 cards, you played 1.
You -3, them -2.
Slide disadvantage against bats and crows, which is one of the strongest of the card efficient combat strategies.

Hands OR Hands with Target Vitals:
You cancel vitals by preventing the 1st point of damage and have 2 more left over just in case this round. You don't hit them for hands or with any of your potence stuff, but they do take 1 hard to prevent damage.
You -0 + your card in play, them -1.
Advantage to the discipline card, check.

Against a typical melee weapon:
You -0 + your card in play, them -0.
(just having a melee weapon gives them a strike alternative to bashing their hand into your wall).
It's a wash, good.

Against someone paying 1 blood to Blur with Hands:
You -0 + your card in play, them -2

Against Blur with a .44 or a vamp with +1 strength
You -3 + your card in play, them -2

Against Blur with a melee weapon that does +1
You -3 + your card in play, them -1
Advantage melee, check.

Against Majesty:
It's a strike card, so you can cycle it, unlike most damage prevention cards (other than Apparition) which can jam in your hand against Earth Meld & Majesty & Oubliette decks.

Against Grapple:
Total loss, you can't play it (Unless you can get to long range to avoid the grapple, or you have grapple canceling cards. If you do manage that, you have your Slab as a power up for later - or for additional strikes).

So it looks like pretty strong defensive tech, especially in terms of card slots. It's certainly no Combat Ends and it has its ups and downs compared to a more straightforward dodge (notable ups: it can help you deal with environmental damage and with multiple strikes).

Those results are also interesting when you throw in some Taste of Vitaes on both sides.

1) No, retaliation damage is not meant to be cold iron. I thought about saying Strike: 2R cold iron damage, but that doesn't fit other card templates. Also to stay on theme, I wanted it to be a Cold Iron card on a minion for purposes of Draeven Softfoot and anything that follows in his model. Conceptually and hopefully by card text, the Kyasid punching a steel slab isn't getting cut by the edges like any victim vamp it is flung at later.

2) You are right, this needs to be hammered out (har, har). I had worded it to follow in the footsteps of Blood of Acid "the opposing minion takes an amount of damage" ... But since it's a strike card, it won't follow those rulings. Card text on Increased Strength and on Target Vitals makes them both eligible to be played, if the condition were met, which isn't always clear during strike selection, depending on who is choosing strikes first. So... it would probably be better to reword it to be only environmental.

Name: Slab of Steel
Cardtype: Combat
Cost: None
Capacity: Not applicable
Discipline: Potence
Clan: None
[pot] Strike: Prevent up to 3 damage this round.
[POT] As above, and the first time the opposing minion strikes with a hand or gun strike this round, they take 1 damage during strike resolution, only preventable by cards that require Fortitude. If this striking vampire does not already have a Slab of Steel, place this card on them. This vampire can burn this cold iron card to Strike: 2R damage.

Lead wrote:

Let's compare against some common combat archetypes and see how it stacks up:

.44 deck using 0-blood celerity cards (Pursuit, Psyche):
Opposing minion goes long and shoots for 2, additional strike with Pursuit for 2 more.
Potence vamp responds with Slab of Steel

-- it prevents 3 during the round so he takes only one damage during the 2nd strike resolution. Nope. You prevent 3 from the first shot. Then the next ranged attack deals 2. You haven't played damage prevention from this additional strike so you take 2.

At superior the opposing minion takes 1 ricochet damage (environmental).

So it's 2 to 1.

The other vamp had a gun (already or concealed) while you did not, you both played 1 card each and you both take 1 damage. Pretty good for you. If you are a POT CEL vamp, you can cash in your own additional strikes and retaliate with the Slab. If they Psyche! you can play another Slab of Steel to achieve the same result, or you can throw your Slab at them, so you both do 2R during the initial strike phase of the new combat.

Bats and Crows
They go long and you are taking 3 damage. You prevent all 3. They press and you are taking 3 more damage, you can hit back for 2R. They played 2 cards, you played 1.
You -3, them -2.
Slide disadvantage against bats and crows, which is one of the strongest of the card efficient combat strategies.

Hands OR Hands with Target Vitals:
You cancel vitals by preventing the 1st point of damage and have 2 more left over just in case this round. You don't hit them for hands or with any of your potence stuff, but they do take 1 hard to prevent damage.
You -0 + your card in play, them -1.
Advantage to the discipline card, check.

Against a typical melee weapon:
You -0 + your card in play, them -0.
(just having a melee weapon gives them a strike alternative to bashing their hand into your wall).
It's a wash, good.

Against someone paying 1 blood to Blur with Hands:
You -0 + your card in play, them -2

Against Blur with a .44 or a vamp with +1 strength
You -3 + your card in play, them -2

Against Blur with a melee weapon that does +1
You -3 + your card in play, them -1
Advantage melee, check.

Against Majesty:
It's a strike card, so you can cycle it, unlike most damage prevention cards (other than Apparition) which can jam in your hand against Earth Meld & Majesty & Oubliette decks.

Against Grapple:
Total loss, you can't play it (Unless you can get to long range to avoid the grapple, or you have grapple canceling cards. If you do manage that, you have your Slab as a power up for later - or for additional strikes).

Don't love it as a weapon but maybe you should basically make it become an item of psuedo-equipment at [POT].

Slab of Steel
Combat
Potence
[pot] Strike: Prevent up to 3 damage this round.
[POT] Put this card on this vampire as a weapon. You may use this card as the [pot] strike above or you may burn it to Strike: 2R. This is a cold iron item.

The ricochet effect seems too text intensive.

chrisn101 wrote:

Aye, nice idea.

In LARP I always thought the sewer lid would make a nice shield for a character with Potence (would stop some bullets, melee weapons and might break a fist) while leaving a hand free for a gun, short single-handed melee weapon, or fist.

Similarly Juggernaut1981's suggestion is good too. I probably over-rely on Earthshock when Lamp-post would be useful (and is more flexible than Thrown sewer lid , which is long range only). Against the other 3R Potence card ( www.secretlibrary.info/index.php?lib=754 ), the free cost but no additional strikes seems balanced. However, I assume the limit wording would be "cannot use additional strikes this round" to stop arguments about Sword of Judgement gaining the additional strike, not the vampire etc....

A weapon can't gain an additional strike, only a minion. The Sword of Judgement stuff tends to be about "Do you have to make the additional WITH the sword or not?" and the answer is "The Sword gives the minion an additional strike BUT doesn't restrict the strike".

Well, you could change the card text to make it work more like common prevent cards with explicit text like "prevent 3 this strike resolution," but the current card text is "prevent 3 this round" -- like Apparition, the damage prevention can be used for any source or strike resolution that round.

If it was just another prevent damage from the opponent's strike card, I think it would be really hard to make it not suck.

Lead wrote:

Well, you could change the card text to make it work more like common prevent cards with explicit text like "prevent 3 this strike resolution," but the current card text is "prevent 3 this round" -- like Apparition, the damage prevention can be used for any source or strike resolution that round.

If it was just another prevent damage from the opponent's strike card, I think it would be really hard to make it not suck.

Basic is what sells this.

Potence (that virtually only hits and grapples) blowing its strike to prevent damage? No blood cost, using yoir strime, etc, seems fair. Now, you cant grapple and so this. Jimmy Dunn could sideslip, play this, pursuit, and throw a lid to catch up with bats n crows. Not game breaking, not impractical.

The backlash is more interesting, but more wordy. The basics of it being a strike, and not limited to preventing a strike, make basic more thought intensive. It also allows inclan Brujah, !Brujah, and Osebo a defensive combat angle with in-clans other than auto-inclide sideslip. If you have celerity, you get to use it well, and you already had access to dodge.
Interesting.