Thoughts on openness, canon

What annoys me : all those cool vampires who have the oh-so useful "One Vote" that restrict them from going anarch.
Danielle Diron, Shemti, Kashan or Maureen spring to mind.
And I didn't mention odd bishops like Violet Tremain or Jefferson Forster whose discipline set are begging you to go anarch.

And being titled allows them only one stuff really : being able to play Red List on another minion -and oh, of course, not going anarch.
Oh why ? -_-

Reyda wrote:

What annoys me : all those cool vampires who have the oh-so useful "One Vote" that restrict them from going anarch.
Danielle Diron, Shemti, Kashan or Maureen spring to mind.
And I didn't mention odd bishops like Violet Tremain or Jefferson Forster whose discipline set are begging you to go anarch.

And being titled allows them only one stuff really : being able to play Red List on another minion -and oh, of course, not going anarch.
Oh why ? -_-

Oddly enough it's something that has been mentioned in playtesting that 'bishop' is actually a liability - you should get yourself in the French group Reyda (or set up a second one!)

Squidalot wrote:

Reyda wrote:

What annoys me : all those cool vampires who have the oh-so useful "One Vote" that restrict them from going anarch.
Danielle Diron, Shemti, Kashan or Maureen spring to mind.
And I didn't mention odd bishops like Violet Tremain or Jefferson Forster whose discipline set are begging you to go anarch.

And being titled allows them only one stuff really : being able to play Red List on another minion -and oh, of course, not going anarch.
Oh why ? -_-

Oddly enough it's something that has been mentioned in playtesting that 'bishop' is actually a liability - you should get yourself in the French group Reyda (or set up a second one!)

Primogen is a greater liability. Good on an affordable vamp with PRE? Eh, possibly. Bishops like Madrid, at least. Though, really, it has more to do with how historically Sabbat vampires have been more focused disciplinewise. That's easily changed to where someone would want more of the Sabbies to anarch themselves. Well, and how the Sabbat sect has a lot more going on than the Camarilla sect.

While it would be nice-ish to see Elisabetta get to show her true power, from a flavor standpoint it would make more sense to close the gap between Primogen and Prince.

Reyda wrote:

What annoys me : all those cool vampires who have the oh-so useful "One Vote" that restrict them from going anarch.
Danielle Diron, Shemti, Kashan or Maureen spring to mind.
And I didn't mention odd bishops like Violet Tremain or Jefferson Forster whose discipline set are begging you to go anarch.

And being titled allows them only one stuff really : being able to play Red List on another minion -and oh, of course, not going anarch.
Oh why ? -_-

There's Out of the Frying Pan and Into the Fire for that, but they are sub optimal. Did a Dr. Jest & Sylvester Simms go anarch deck just after Anarchs set came out. It wasn't pretty. Hmm, I should revisit that...

However I did work Into the Fire for good effect with Marcus Vitel and Assamites going Sabbat (before there were any Sabbat Assamites). A sect swapping trifle that gains you +1 bleed v. Camarilla is kinda fun.

And I thought only city titles keep their votes in Anarch Secession, switching into Baronies. Unless there's a ruling I forgot I'm pretty sure we were talking in The Path of Blood how sect swapping ended up suppressing your indie titles because you now answer to a new group. I thought that was the point of the errata of all previous indie votes to be labeled "titled" in the first place.

EDIT: Looked at Rulebook for Sect info...

10. Vampire Sects
[...]
A vampire must belong to the appropriate sect to receive a title. If a vampire with a title changes clans or sects to a clan or sect inappropriate for his title, he loses the benefit of the title until his clan or sect changes appropriately. If he receives a new title, or if his title is contested (see Contested Titles, sec. 4.2), he immediately yields the old title.

So... switching Aziz to Sabbat with Into the Fire should suppress his title because he's going from Independent to Sabbat, where his title wouldn't be recognized. But if Aziz just used Anarch Secession, he's just gaining the Anarch trait, not changing sects, and thus keeps his 2 votes. But you must be independent to do this. Interesting...

Otherwise AS card text only allows a sect's city titles to carry over.

Anarch Secession
+1 stealth action. Requires a ready, non-anarch, titled vampire.
Put an anarch counter on this acting vampire. This vampire becomes anarch (and Independent). If he or she had a city title, put this card on him or her as a title card to represent the title of baron of the same city. Minions without titles cannot block this action. Burn the anarch counter if this vampire changes sects.

Back to the original question of options for titles, I was looking over a list of vamp genealogy earlier for fun, and another option occurred to me:

There are plenty of Canon cities left uncovered by cards that have either a Prince or archbishop, and also noted conflicts between sects. why not just take the liberty of assigning titles based on who has them in the source material, which is often multiple vampires of the samesect anyway, and then using the sourcebooks, determine who of the opposing sect makes sense as someone who could overthrow them?

Its kinda a middle ground option, but others may not be as open to new vamps as I am.