file Cancelling combats and Momentary delay

29 Jan 2012 14:59 #22005 by drnlmza
Several action modifiers cancel combat after being blocked without explicitly ending the action (such as Stone Travel at :MYT: or Phantom Speaker at :chi:), so, unlike the case of something like Mirror Walk, cards which can be played at the end of the action can still be played .

Does cancelling combat like this count as "ending combat before the press step" for Momentray Delay? I assume it does, but the "after any combats" qualification on Momentray Delay suggests combat isn't required.

:obt: This vampire burns 1 blood to get +1 stealth.
:myt: +1 stealth.
:MYT: +1 stealth. If this action is blocked, this acting vampire may choose to cancel the resulting combat.

Requires a vampire with capacity 7 or more.
Only usable at the end of an action blocked by an ally or a vampire of capacity 5 or less (after any combats). Not usable if more than one round of combat has occurred nor if this vampire has lost 3 or more blood this action or ended combat before the press step. The action continues as if unblocked.


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South Africa

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29 Jan 2012 15:26 - 29 Jan 2012 15:28 #22007 by Pullen
I guess it depends on whether canceling combat and ending combat are the same thing. I personally would say no, they aren't and that you could play the two together.

:OBT::MYT::PRO::val::obf:
Last edit: 29 Jan 2012 15:28 by Pullen.

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29 Jan 2012 21:17 - 29 Jan 2012 21:19 #22033 by Pascal Bertrand
Cancelling combat is not the same thing as ending combat before the press step, if that is the question. Cards that end combat read "End combat" (or variants such as "combat ends"), which Stone Travel or Phantom Speaker don't read.

Momentary Delay is usable after a combat was cancelled via Stone Travel.
Last edit: 29 Jan 2012 21:19 by Pascal Bertrand.

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30 Jan 2012 05:14 #22043 by drnlmza

Momentary Delay is usable after a combat was cancelled via Stone Travel.

Awesome - pointing our local Imbued player to this ruling will be a great deal of fun :evil:.

So, a couple of follow up questions to make sure I've understood the implications of this correctly:
  1. Since there's nothing limiting the Stone Travel cancel effect, if blocked after continuing the action with Momentary Delay, I can choose to cancel the combat again, right?
  2. Since the slave rule is also just a "cancel combat" effect, and invoking it doesn't end the action nor does it change the acting minion, Momentary Delay is also playable after a slave combat (assuming other conditions apply)?

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South Africa

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30 Jan 2012 06:14 - 30 Jan 2012 06:15 #22045 by jAvel
1. From genaral rulings: "If an effect continues a blocked action "as if unblocked", then all action modifiers, including stealth and Dawn Operation, are still in effect. [RTR 19941109]"
2. I guess it'll be the same as play Psyche!, Hidden Lurker or other combat starting effect: "continue action as unblocked" part is cancelled. But i'm not sure. Mb, should look the 'slave' ruling.
Last edit: 30 Jan 2012 06:15 by jAvel.

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30 Jan 2012 07:34 #22047 by Pascal Bertrand

So, a couple of follow up questions to make sure I've understood the implications of this correctly:
  1. Since there's nothing limiting the Stone Travel cancel effect, if blocked after continuing the action with Momentary Delay, I can choose to cancel the combat again, right?
  2. Since the slave rule is also just a "cancel combat" effect, and invoking it doesn't end the action nor does it change the acting minion, Momentary Delay is also playable after a slave combat (assuming other conditions apply)?

  1. Correct, as stated by jAvel [RTR 19941109]
  2. Momentary Delay is playable indeed at the end of an action where the Slave rule was invoked (assuming other conditions apply). Using the Slave rule doesn't end combat.

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