Caitiff, the Puzzling
16 Apr 2012 22:12 - 16 Apr 2012 22:13 #28026
by Malcolm Sprye
Caitiff, the Puzzling was created by Malcolm Sprye
Okay, so the matter of Caitiff being clanless came up at the NYC qualifier a couple of days ago. Someone was playing a weenie vote deck and tried to name caitiff for Con Boon. They found out that they couldn't do so. This re-raised some questions which I've never seen satisfactorily answered. Here they are:
1. Just to be clear, Caitiff is not a clan, correct?
2. Not all clanless vampires are Caitiff, correct? e.g. Shock troops is not caitiff.
3. I've seen discussions that involved reputable sources talking about a deck running Mukhtar Bey and third tradition to make caitiff babies ( I think they were for consumption by Al' Muntaquim). So, if caitiff isn't a clan, why does Third Tradition produce Caitiff babies, as opposed to generic, claness babies? The card says nothing about transferring nebulous keywords from the parent, just the clan.
So yah. I searched the rules, and all I found was a single mention which said that technically Caitiff are clanless. That's it.
1. Just to be clear, Caitiff is not a clan, correct?
2. Not all clanless vampires are Caitiff, correct? e.g. Shock troops is not caitiff.
3. I've seen discussions that involved reputable sources talking about a deck running Mukhtar Bey and third tradition to make caitiff babies ( I think they were for consumption by Al' Muntaquim). So, if caitiff isn't a clan, why does Third Tradition produce Caitiff babies, as opposed to generic, claness babies? The card says nothing about transferring nebulous keywords from the parent, just the clan.
So yah. I searched the rules, and all I found was a single mention which said that technically Caitiff are clanless. That's it.
Last edit: 16 Apr 2012 22:13 by Malcolm Sprye.
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16 Apr 2012 22:58 - 16 Apr 2012 23:03 #28028
by Adonai
Replied by Adonai on topic Re: Caitiff, the Puzzling
1) Caitiff is a trait, not a clan.
LSJ 11-21-2005
2) Not all clanless vampires have the Caitiff trait. LSJ 11-21-2005
3) New vampires sired by Caitiff are Caitff, by ruling. (Embrace, Third Tradition, etc.) LSJ 12-28-2001 and LSJ 01-02-2002
2) Not all clanless vampires have the Caitiff trait. LSJ 11-21-2005
3) New vampires sired by Caitiff are Caitff, by ruling. (Embrace, Third Tradition, etc.) LSJ 12-28-2001 and LSJ 01-02-2002
Last edit: 16 Apr 2012 23:03 by Adonai.
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17 Apr 2012 01:33 - 17 Apr 2012 10:39 #28031
by Juggernaut1981




Baron of Sydney, Australia, 418
Replied by Juggernaut1981 on topic Re: Caitiff, the Puzzling
The really short version is... Cause LSJ said so.
[this post existed because the cancel button still doesn't work properly]
[this post existed because the cancel button still doesn't work properly]





Last edit: 17 Apr 2012 10:39 by Juggernaut1981.
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17 Apr 2012 02:17 #28035
by KevinM
Kevin M., Prince of Las Vegas
"Know your enemy and know yourself; in one-thousand battles
you shall never be in peril." -- Sun Tzu, *The Art of War*
"Contentment...Complacency...Catastrophe!" -- Joseph Chevalier
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Replied by KevinM on topic Re: Caitiff, the Puzzling
LSJ had nothing to do with it AFAIK. The source material states that Caitiff are clanless iirc.
Kevin M., Prince of Las Vegas
"Know your enemy and know yourself; in one-thousand battles
you shall never be in peril." -- Sun Tzu, *The Art of War*
"Contentment...Complacency...Catastrophe!" -- Joseph Chevalier
Please visit VTESville daily! vtesville.myminicity.com/
Facebook: www.facebook.com/groups/129744447064017
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17 Apr 2012 02:28 #28036
by Malcolm Sprye
Replied by Malcolm Sprye on topic Re: Caitiff, the Puzzling
Yes Kevin, and that's ALL it said. As printed, embrace, 3rd trad, etc have NO reason to transfer the Caitiff "trait" to the baby. I was just trying to figure out if there was some rule I missed, or if it was simply "because".
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17 Apr 2012 02:35 #28038
by KevinM
Kevin M., Prince of Las Vegas
"Know your enemy and know yourself; in one-thousand battles
you shall never be in peril." -- Sun Tzu, *The Art of War*
"Contentment...Complacency...Catastrophe!" -- Joseph Chevalier
Please visit VTESville daily! vtesville.myminicity.com/
Facebook: www.facebook.com/groups/129744447064017
Replied by KevinM on topic Re: Caitiff, the Puzzling
Embrace
Put this card in play; it becomes a non-unique vampire with 1 capacity of the same clan as the acting vampire.
3rd Trad
Put this card in play; it becomes a non-unique 1-capacity vampire of the same clan as the acting vampire.
So, since Caitiff are clanless, what would you have the card do?
Put this card in play; it becomes a non-unique vampire with 1 capacity of the same clan as the acting vampire.
3rd Trad
Put this card in play; it becomes a non-unique 1-capacity vampire of the same clan as the acting vampire.
So, since Caitiff are clanless, what would you have the card do?
Kevin M., Prince of Las Vegas
"Know your enemy and know yourself; in one-thousand battles
you shall never be in peril." -- Sun Tzu, *The Art of War*
"Contentment...Complacency...Catastrophe!" -- Joseph Chevalier
Please visit VTESville daily! vtesville.myminicity.com/
Facebook: www.facebook.com/groups/129744447064017
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