file Karsh

13 May 2012 14:16 #30146 by Pendargon
Karsh was created by Pendargon
I have in play merged Karsh, and Fall of the camarilla is in play.

1. Does Karsh retain his 3 votes as Imperator? ( i think yes, as Imerator is not by default a camarilla title, at least is not listed as such in the rulebook : Only Camarilla vampires can hold the Camarilla titles primogen, prince, justicar and Inner Circle member. Additionally, each clan's justicar and Inner Circle titles are unique (see Contested Titles, sec. 4.2) )

2. Is Karsh still able to play Blood hunt card from hand or ash heap? ( i would say yes, as he plays it AS prince or justicar, though he never is one )

Thanx in advance

Gangrel
Capacity: 10
Group: 3
Advanced, Camarilla: Karsh may play a Blood Hunt card from your hand or ash heap as a prince. He gets 3 additional votes in blood hunt referendums. He cannot block infernal vampires.
[MERGED] Imperator (3 votes): +1 intercept.

Fall of the Camarilla, Event, 3 Gehenna cards
Gehenna. Do not replace as long as this card is in play. Requires at least three other Gehenna cards in play. There is no Camarilla. Any Camarilla vampire is considered Independent instead.

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13 May 2012 15:42 - 13 May 2012 15:43 #30149 by TorranceCircle
Replied by TorranceCircle on topic Re: Karsh
I copied this from secret library:


Imperator
Political Action
Title.
Choose a Camarilla vampire with capacity 8 or more. If this referendum is successful, put this card on the chosen vampire to represent the unique Camarilla title of Imperator (worth 3 votes). This vampire may play a Blood Hunt card from your hand or ash heap as a prince. This vampire gets 3 additional votes in blood hunt referendums.

Artist(s): Justin Norman

Set(s): Promo-20090401


This would seem to indicate it is a camarilla title.
Last edit: 13 May 2012 15:43 by TorranceCircle.

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13 May 2012 16:48 #30152 by Pendargon
Replied by Pendargon on topic Re: Karsh
yes, i know that, but it is on the card. As far as i understand previous rulings, when Karsh merges, he gets only 6 votes in blood hunt referendums, not 9 (which would be implied by the full cardtext of the imperator).

That is why i am confused. Is the cardtext of the imperator card relevant to describe the whole imperator title benefit, or not?

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13 May 2012 17:03 #30153 by Pascal Bertrand
Replied by Pascal Bertrand on topic Re: Karsh
It should be in the rulebook that Imperator is a Camarilla title.
However, one should not confuse the effects of the Imperator card (quoted above) and the Imperator title (unique, worth 3 votes, and that's all).
Similarly, the Prince of Rome doesn't get 1 extra capacity if they are Brujah, even though the Praxis Seizure: Rome does increase the Brujah Prince of Rome's capacity by one.

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13 May 2012 17:52 #30155 by Megabaja
Replied by Megabaja on topic Re: Karsh
Wait if non merged Karsh becomes Imperator he gets:

by cardtext of Imperator:

Choose a Camarilla vampire with capacity 8 or more. If this referendum is successful, put this card on the chosen vampire to represent the unique Camarilla title of Imperator (worth 3 votes). This vampire may play a Blood Hunt card from your hand or ash heap as a prince. This vampire gets 3 additional votes in blood hunt referendums.

by text on Karsh ADV:

Advanced, Camarilla: Karsh may play a Blood Hunt card from your hand or ash heap as a prince. He gets 3 additional votes in blood hunt referendums. He cannot block infernal vampires.

It is 3 votes during referendums and and additional 6 in blood hunts. Or am I wrong?

Ignorance is bliss.
Cypher, Matrix

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13 May 2012 17:57 #30156 by Pendargon
Replied by Pendargon on topic Re: Karsh
you are wrong.

Imperator is just a title worth 3 votes. Becoming the Imperator by CARD Imperator gives you additional benefits.

If you pascal say that Imperator is by default a Camarilla title, then it is so indeed, and yes, i agree, it should be in the rulebook.

How about answer to my second question then?

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