Graverobbing and Carver's Meat Packing and Storage
12 Jul 2012 03:36 #33078
by AaronC
You say that you can't use the effect. I wonder if that's true. Can you not use the effect at all or does the effect do nothing?
The text of Carver's doesn't say that hostages can't be the target or user of actions or effects that would move them to the ready region, just that they can't be moved to the ready region.
I'm curious how this works compared to taking control of something you already control, tapping a tapped minion, moving something that isn't there, and playing an effect on minions who are immune to the effect.
Replied by AaronC on topic Re: Graverobbing and Carver's Meat Packing and Storage
You can play Graverobbing atsince the extra effect is only optional, but you cannot use it.
You say that you can't use the effect. I wonder if that's true. Can you not use the effect at all or does the effect do nothing?
The text of Carver's doesn't say that hostages can't be the target or user of actions or effects that would move them to the ready region, just that they can't be moved to the ready region.
I'm curious how this works compared to taking control of something you already control, tapping a tapped minion, moving something that isn't there, and playing an effect on minions who are immune to the effect.
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12 Jul 2012 05:25 #33080
by Amenophobis
Peace of Khetamon, The
Political Action
Choose a vampire in torpor. Successful referendum means that vampire is moved to the uncontrolled region (facedown). The vampire's blood counters, master cards and minion cards stay with that vampire, with any counters they have on them (they are out of play as long as the vampire remains uncontrolled).
Emphasis mine.
Replied by Amenophobis on topic Re: Graverobbing and Carver's Meat Packing and Storage
Id say no. Because Banishment says younger and ready vampire. Which your vampire obviously isnt anymore as he/she is in torpor.
Choose a younger ready vampire. Successful referendum means that the chosen vampire is moved to the uncontrolled region (breaking any temporary control effects). The vampire is uncontrolled. Any cards and counters on that vampire stay with him or her (but they are out of play as long as the vampire remains uncontrolled).
Artist: Steve Casper
Peace of Khetamon, The
Political Action
Choose a vampire in torpor. Successful referendum means that vampire is moved to the uncontrolled region (facedown). The vampire's blood counters, master cards and minion cards stay with that vampire, with any counters they have on them (they are out of play as long as the vampire remains uncontrolled).
Emphasis mine.
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12 Jul 2012 07:49 - 12 Jul 2012 07:53 #33084
by Ankha
Likewise, you can't play a frenzy card on a vampire immune to frenzy cards. You can't play it "just to cycle".
If a vampire with a hostage counter is moved to the uncontrolled region, he keeps his hostage counter (where it has no effect). If he has blood equal to (or greater than) his capacity, he is moved automatically to the ready region at the end of your influence phase, except he can't (because if he would come into play, so would the counter and the counter prevents this from happening). So he stays in your uncontrolled region.
(Because of the analogy with the Anarch Convert special text that can be used as he would come into play, before he really enters play and becomes contested).
This is maybe not the designer intent, except that nothing prohibits the hostage counter from working when the vampire would come back into play.
(A reminder link about Banishment etc.: groups.google.com/group/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/msg/6029edb7384bced4)
Replied by Ankha on topic Re: Graverobbing and Carver's Meat Packing and Storage
You can't do things you're prohibited from by a "you can't" clause.You say that you can't use the effect. I wonder if that's true. Can you not use the effect at all or does the effect do nothing?
Likewise, you can't play a frenzy card on a vampire immune to frenzy cards. You can't play it "just to cycle".
Peace of Khetamon, The
Political Action
Choose a vampire in torpor. Successful referendum means that vampire is moved to the uncontrolled region (facedown). The vampire's blood counters, master cards and minion cards stay with that vampire, with any counters they have on them (they are out of play as long as the vampire remains uncontrolled).
Emphasis mine.
If a vampire with a hostage counter is moved to the uncontrolled region, he keeps his hostage counter (where it has no effect). If he has blood equal to (or greater than) his capacity, he is moved automatically to the ready region at the end of your influence phase, except he can't (because if he would come into play, so would the counter and the counter prevents this from happening). So he stays in your uncontrolled region.
(Because of the analogy with the Anarch Convert special text that can be used as he would come into play, before he really enters play and becomes contested).
This is maybe not the designer intent, except that nothing prohibits the hostage counter from working when the vampire would come back into play.
(A reminder link about Banishment etc.: groups.google.com/group/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/msg/6029edb7384bced4)
This works only for counters in play, on vampires in play.Any ready vampire may burn 2 blood to burn any vampire's hostage counter during any untap phase.
Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
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12 Jul 2012 12:14 #33090
by Amenophobis
Yes, I understood your posting. I only wanted to point out that Eric also mentioned Peace of Khetamon, and that it works differently from Banishment as it has to be played on vampires in torpor.
I readily agree that Peace of Khetamon is not widely played or even known. B-)
Replied by Amenophobis on topic Re: Graverobbing and Carver's Meat Packing and Storage
@ Amenophobis
The query was with banishment primarily so the text i quoted was from Banishment.
For example, a vampire is sent to torpor with a hostage counter and is then Banished (or Peace of Khetamon'ed)
Yes, I understood your posting. I only wanted to point out that Eric also mentioned Peace of Khetamon, and that it works differently from Banishment as it has to be played on vampires in torpor.
I readily agree that Peace of Khetamon is not widely played or even known. B-)
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12 Jul 2012 12:15 #33091
by Ankha
Replied by Ankha on topic Re: Graverobbing and Carver's Meat Packing and Storage
? You can't call Banishment on a vampire in torpor, as noted above.@ Amenophobis
The query was with banishment primarily so the text i quoted was from Banishment.
For example, a vampire is sent to torpor with a hostage counter and is then Banished (or Peace of Khetamon'ed)
Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
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