file Conditioning + DI - SOS answer needed

18 Aug 2012 13:16 #35003 by Mr_Toreador
Hello guys, the question is as simple as it gets:

There is a bleed action, no block, playing conditioning. There is a Direct Intervention plazed on it. Can a Threats be plazed after the DI?

Thanks in advance!

Mr_Toreador

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18 Aug 2012 13:21 #35004 by Klaital
Yes, Threats can be played, or any other bleed modifier (but not another Conditioning). Since the Conditioning was canceled, no part of its text, including the 'no other bleed modifier can be played' kicked in.

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19 Aug 2012 07:22 #35016 by Malachy
Are you sure? Then How comes one cannot play another Carrion Crows after the first one is canceled? Or am I wrong again (not the first time in DI subject...)?

Pascal, would you create a hint for DI? It is really confusing which cards can or cannot be played again... I'm not referring to a days-of-work list, just a small one, like:

When DI is played to cancel a card, you cannot play another one IF...
- Combat cards - Why? keytext - (examples)
- Action Modifier - Why? keytext - (examples) etc...

I'd create it mayself, should i know conditions right :/

NC of Hungary

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19 Aug 2012 07:27 - 19 Aug 2012 07:35 #35017 by Boris The Blade

Are you sure? Then How comes one cannot play another Carrion Crows after the first one is canceled? Or am I wrong again (not the first time in DI subject...)?

Because the way it is worded (and contrary to Conditioning), the text on the second Carrion Crows is enough to prevent it from being played, the text on the first one is not needed.
Last edit: 19 Aug 2012 07:35 by Boris The Blade.

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19 Aug 2012 07:40 #35018 by Malachy
Wow... indeed::blink:

NC of Hungary

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19 Aug 2012 12:42 #35027 by Pascal Bertrand

Hello guys, the question is as simple as it gets:

There is a bleed action, no block, playing conditioning. There is a Direct Intervention plazed on it. Can a Threats be plazed after the DI?

Thanks in advance!

Mr_Toreador

Yes. As Klaital said, the part on Conditioning that forbids the play of other bleed increasers (as much as the part boosting the bleed amount) doesn't happen.

Are you sure? Then How comes one cannot play another Carrion Crows after the first one is canceled? Or am I wrong again (not the first time in DI subject...)?

Pascal, would you create a hint for DI? It is really confusing which cards can or cannot be played again... I'm not referring to a days-of-work list, just a small one, like:

When DI is played to cancel a card, you cannot play another one IF...
- Combat cards - Why? keytext - (examples)
- Action Modifier - Why? keytext - (examples) etc...

I'd create it mayself, should i know conditions right :/

Let's first check the Rulebook

Cancel a card”: A "canceled" card has no effect, but it is still considered played. Unless explicitly written, cost for the card is paid. If the card was a strike card, the minion who played it must choose a strike, which might come from another strike card. If the card was an action card, the minion doesn’t tap (he doesn’t pay for the action card), and can play the same action card again.

Let's look at several cardtexts ;)

Name: Carrion Crows
[Sabbat:C, SW:C/PT2, CE:PN2, Anarchs:PG2, BH:PN3, LoB:PA2, Third:C, LotN:PR3, KoT:C]
Cardtype: Combat
Discipline: Animalism
Only usable before range is chosen.
[ani] The opposing minion takes 1R damage each round of combat during strike resolution. A vampire can play only one Carrion Crows each combat.
Name: Immortal Grapple
[Jyhad:R2, VTES:R, Sabbat:U, SW:U/PB, FN:PG, CE:U/PB2, Third:U, LotN:PG2, KoT:U/PB3, HttB:PGar3]
Cardtype: Combat
Discipline: Potence
Only usable at close range before strikes are chosen. Grapple.
[pot] Strikes that are not hand strikes may not be used this round (by either combatant). A vampire may play only one Immortal Grapple each round.


So, suppose Beast is in combat. He plays Carrion Crows in the Before Range is set step, and CC gets DI'd. This CC has no effect but it was played, nevertheless. A second Carrion Crows would read "A vampire can play only one CC each combat", which forbids it from being played (as it would be the second CC played by Beast in that combat).
Same goes for Immortal Grapple.

Name: Spell of Life
[LotN:C]
Cardtype: Action
Clan: Follower of Set
+1 stealth action.
Put this card in play. Only one Spell of Life may be played each turn. You may burn five Spells of Life to put up to five vampires from your uncontrolled region in play. Each represents a unique mummy ally with life equal to capacity, 1 bleed and 2 strength who can enter combat with a minion as a (D) action.

If Celine Chevalier plays Spell of Life, and SoL gets DI'd, Celine can't play a second Spell of Life

There is no difference between "DI vs action modifier" or "DI vs combat cards". It's all in cardtext.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Malachy

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