Does entering combat tap you...?

ReverendRevolver wrote:

Animalism DOES have tier of souls, and theres always leverage.

Also, you can bolt on Abo for a bleed pump (ousted with that card like 5 times)

And there are gangrel/!gangrel with presence.....

Sorry, I was clearly mistaken, gangrel and !gangrel are well known to be Heavy bleeders and a player which will let himself drop under 10 pools with celeste lamontagne and janey pickman as predator is a fool because there is no way he will have another turn.

Bums Rush + Majesty + Powerbleed.

Absolutely a thing we encounter. Notably, "our" Brujah are better than "your" Brujah.

In general, we've never had a problem with the Bruise & Bleed archetype, from a number of Clans, being effective. Our decks tend towards that; I've always *assumed* it was a casual, fun-oriented choice, but come to think of it, it might partially be a shape our meta bent us into...?

ThatGuyThere wrote:

In general, we've never had a problem with the Bruise & Bleed archetype, from a number of Clans, being effective. Our decks tend towards that; I've always *assumed* it was a casual, fun-oriented choice, but come to think of it, it might partially be a shape our meta bent us into...?

"Casual rush", as opposed to more dedicated rush, is much more likely to be useful in an environment where a 'failed' rush (i.e. you didn't smash the opponent into torpor) still has a significant deleterious effect. So perhaps it doesn't matter that you don't have all the parts required for significant thumping - the maneuvers, the anti-S:CE, the large damage, the ability to survive, the Taste of Vitae etc. This might allow you to, say, include fewer of those tools, in exchange for including more bleed. You probably still run up against the issue of hand jam a bit - crap, I have bleed cards in my hand when I want combat, and vice versa - but the impact of it is slightly lessened because you can more reliably get a tapped minion out of it even if you couldn't smash it to death, so it's probably then easier to cycle the bleed with your next couple of actions.

I'd potentially expect it to make weenie rush a bit better - my 3 cap with obf/pot can probably tap your 8 cap dude and maybe smash him up - and have a slightly easier time ousting you, due to you more likely being tapped out. (Obviously, some decks will have Majesty at superior, Earth Meld, and similar cards, but not all decks all the time.)

Timo wrote:

ReverendRevolver wrote:

Animalism DOES have tier of souls, and theres always leverage.

Also, you can bolt on Abo for a bleed pump (ousted with that card like 5 times)

And there are gangrel/!gangrel with presence.....

Sorry, I was clearly mistaken, gangrel and !gangrel are well known to be Heavy bleeders and a player which will let himself drop under 10 pools with celeste lamontagne and janey pickman as predator is a fool because there is no way he will have another turn.

Only if they have Abo. Tier of souled vamp bleeds with deep song, preds mastery =4, next one does same with leverage for 5, third does it without leverage..... oh, and one from rats. Of course, its only 14, and you're doing stealthbleed wrong, but its still possible.

Bear in mind that we are talking about winning with gangrel, so seeing a deck with tier, abo, preds mastery, leverage, and deep song is pheasable. Because if gangrel are winning, we're already in imagination land......

Deep earth decks work, though, and Ariadne can bleed for 4 twice a turn at one stealth in my last Ariadne deck.....

If you need minions tapped, run weenie dom and some agent of powers, then add spirit marionette. Maybe add mr noir. So, maybe with a spontaneous power too, you can tap things while bleeding, amd hold conditioning for when you arent blocked......