file Warsaw Station vs Diablerie, Graverobbing

22 Oct 2015 09:46 #73815 by Joscha
I couldn't find an entry about this question.

Yesterfay we wondered if Cock Robin can leave torpor via Warsaw Station in the middle of an action like Graverobbing or diablerie, thus letting fizzle the action.

(Sorry for not posting the relevant card text, posting through mobile).

Baron of Frankfurt

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22 Oct 2015 10:30 - 22 Oct 2015 10:32 #73816 by jamesatzephyr

I couldn't find an entry about this question.

Yesterfay we wondered if Cock Robin can leave torpor via Warsaw Station in the middle of an action like Graverobbing or diablerie, thus letting fizzle the action.

(Sorry for not posting the relevant card text, posting through mobile).

Master: unique location.
You may tap this card when a Nosferatu announces an undirected action. If that action is successful, the acting Nosferatu untaps. You may burn this card (even if it is tapped) to move a Nosferatu in torpor to the ready region.

[LSJ 20101010]

The setup, from some bum called Floppyzedolfin:
Suppose I control a Warsaw Station an untapped Rabbat in torpor. My
prey declares an action to diablerize my Rabbat in torpor.
I decide to burn the Warsaw Station to move Rabbat back from torpor to
my ready region before declaring a block attempt.

Is the action still a diablerie action?
Is the action a directed action against ready Rabbat?
Is the action still a directed action against me?
Can ready Rabbat attempt to block it? (the answer to this one should
be the same as the answer to the second one)

> > > Is the action still a diablerie action?
>
> Yes, the action was properly announced and is attempted diablerie.
>
> > > Is the action a directed action against ready Rabbat?
>
> Yes, until it reaches resolution at which point it fizzles due to
> having no valid target on which to resolve. But until that point, the
> action is valid. Search Harass + untap and look at the 2nd tradition
> example for precedents.
>
> > > Is the action still a directed action against me?
>
> Yes, until it fails to resolve - which includes all of the block
> declaration window.
>
> > > Can ready Rabbat attempt to block it? (the answer to this one should
> > > be the same as the answer to the second one)
>
> Yes, again, see the Harass + 2nd Tradition example, in which the
> responding Prince is forced to block (by card text) in response to
> untapping in an attempt to avoid the Harass target availability.
>
> > I'm adding this one:
> > Since my prey is performing the action and I am the one who can
> > declare a block attempt, if I pass, will any other player receive the
> > opportunity to declare a block attempt ?
>
> Yes, but only in specific cases which allow those players to attempt
> to block D actions after the target player has passed (Eagle's Sight,
> Falcon's Eye and Anneke).

Correct.


The key part for diablerie being this:
> Yes, until it reaches resolution at which point it fizzles due to
> having no valid target on which to resolve.


For a card like Graverobbing:
(D) Steal a vampire in torpor controlled by another Methuselah.

That fizzles for the same reason when reaching resolution - no vampire in torpor. Similarly, Ambush fizzles if you untap during the action (before resolution) .
Last edit: 22 Oct 2015 10:32 by jamesatzephyr.

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22 Oct 2015 11:54 #73825 by Joscha
Great, thanks!

What an awesome card WS is. :-)

Baron of Frankfurt

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22 Oct 2015 17:00 #73836 by Ashur

What an awesome card WS is. :-)

Indeed. GREAT design.

"My strategy? Luck is my strategy, of course."

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