Nosferatu - Give them some love...

I do not get the "broken Camarilla cards" comment...

All the "high end" cam cards like 2nd trad, parity shit, alastor, justicar titles, whatever else.

Really we need to fix nos-anti first. They are way worse off.

Lönkka wrote:

I do not get the "broken Camarilla cards" comment...

I can only assume it refers to the cards requiring princes or justicars.. Which camarilla Nosferatu can make use of, just usually without voter captivation.

Mewcat wrote:

All the "high end" cam cards like 2nd trad, parity shit, alastor, justicar titles, whatever else.

Really we need to fix nos-anti first. They are way worse off.

If we fixed Sabbat as a whole, it would help !nos the same way as camarilla cards benefit normal nosferatu... I don't think !nos have anything going for them except vermin channel and that card is problematic to utilize properly.

Having all the new untap techs as locations, can also be problematic. As you can only have so many masters within a deck. Its not really possible to stuff in all the nice masters, even if they are good. Although, I like the untap effects idea. Maybe they could get something as an action like:

ACTION X

Nos/!Nos

Unique
1 Stealth

Put this card in play with 3 counters, you can burn a counter from this card during your Minion phase to untap a ready Nosferatu or Nosferatu Antitribu you control. If the action to put this card in play is successful, untap this acting vampire.

Cost: 1 Pool

Also, Sabbat already have some great cards, that !Nosferatu can utilize, like Under Siege and Abbot. The problem is just that they are a bit fragile in combat, and are not the best in utilizing the said sabbat cards either. Sabbat is very different from Camarilla and excel in very different things. I like how the two differentiate from each other with the sect specific cards. Where Camarilla ones are more aggressive and political, and Sabbat ones are more blocky and maybe a bit more bleed oriented.

Right now in my Baron Dieudonne + Cock Robin deck there are 3 Warsaw Station. When one is in play, I never discard the second, just in case if someone ends up in torpor.

When I wouldn't use those two vampires, I would put in a (75-80 cards) deck:
2 Warsaw Station
1 Social Network Accounts
1 Shared shelter
4 Easy Work

So that's not a big number of cards (4 masters and 4 modifiers), and I would try to make a deck with Zelios (which is currently useless) and the mid-cap vampires.

All these cards can be Nos/!Nos, as they suffer from the same problem. And according to the story, Nos and !Nos sometimes work together and share informations, as they understand each other because they are in the same shitty position.

I do agree with that !nos seem to, ultimately, have it better than their Camarilla comrades.

Sabbat is great in defense, !Nos even more so. Camarilla's titled cards are more offensive. The difference between those is sorta that defensive strategies have a similar power level no matter the trick you're using - it ends the action, whatever action, on it's tracks. Bounce is different of course, but still.

So defense is kind of binary, and you have oust mechanisms for walls in generic masters. Offensive capability checks numbers however: there is a difference in what sort of action you eventually ram or sneak through. Even Camarilla Nos can't make best use of Camarilla's great offensive actions (Parity Shift is getting the stick anyways), since comparatively they don't do them any better than other clans.

That, in my opinion, makes !Nos stand in a better place than C.Nos. They just can't leverage those powerful Camarilla cards as well as other Camarilla clans. And, if we agree that defensive strength is closing in on binary, but offensive strength scales, !Nos seem better than C.Nos.

But that's all very general, of course.

People have been saying that it would be nice to promote the story aspect more where Nossies don't care about Camarilla or Sabbat allegiance that much. I wouldn't mind it. Which has it worse is basically semantics - they both are in a bad spot.

Multi act is something that could help Nosferatu. You're in the right track with that. Multi acting tools helped Protean users loads in Instantaneous Transformation. But I would argue that offense that would scale better than tool up with generic bleed bonuses would be what Nos ultimately need.

I did design a card that allows for actions that let you guess for a card by name, and if you hit that from the target's hand they'll discard that card and burn 2 pool. I think it was called Brood of Brokers. You might find that and other cards I designed for Nosferatu back then with a quick search.