Compromise on Villein

Elotar,
You have kind of proved the opposite by listing at least 5 examples where decks including Minion Taps have one. Including one which would clearly appear to be a 'less likely' Tier 1 deck because it includes Malk Pranks.

From that I'd be more likely to suggest that Villein isn't necessary but more of a global (but possibly just US & Euro) metagame trend.

elotar wrote:

I just brosed TWDA in serch for minion tap:

1. December 20, 2010 14 players This guy also plays Malkavian Prank
2. September 5, 2010 13 players. Son of Robert Goudie "Created to be used by my sons as their first deck when learning to play"
3. September 4, 2010 13 players
4. August 20, 2010 12 players
5. July 24, 2010 15 players

That's all for 2010-2011.

Apd: It's unreasonable to assume that you will win with Minion tap in any serious competition.

Part 2:
Is the card which, being a trifle, allows to gain up to 11 pool too good?

The interesting thing I notice from looking at those decks is that one of them, Michael Courtois' Arika and Friends Tap & Bleed probably works better with Minion Tap than it would with Villeins.

Gargoylee wrote:

The interesting thing I notice from looking at those decks is that one of them, Michael Courtois' Arika and Friends Tap & Bleed probably works better with Minion Tap than it would with Villeins.

Quite right. If you look up "Ector Has No Vision," which Darby based on Mike's deck here, you'll find a deck built specifically to dispute the claim that Ector made on the newsgroup that Villein is always better than Minion Tap.

elotar wrote:

I just brosed TWDA in serch for minion tap:

1. December 20, 2010 14 players This guy also plays Malkavian Prank
2. September 5, 2010 13 players. Son of Robert Goudie "Created to be used by my sons as their first deck when learning to play"
3. September 4, 2010 13 players
4. August 20, 2010 12 players
5. July 24, 2010 15 players

That's all for 2010-2011.

Apd: It's unreasonable to assume that you will win with Minion tap in any serious competition.

Part 2:
Is the card which, being a trifle, allows to gain up to 11 pool too good?

From what I undestand, Villein exists to keep Minion Tap in check. For years, MT allowed huge pool gains through reliable minion-filling like Voter Captivation, Giant's Blood, et al. and was seen to contribute to games being too long. In a perfect game, and with the benefit of hindsight, no card should probably ever have been printed that allowed for more than three pool gain.

Still, Villein adds diminishing returns to MT while offering a better-costed alternative to it. I agree with juggernaut that meta trends are still likely adjusting to the new kid on the block.

But seriously, you don't need Villein or Minion Tap. Using your master phase for Pool recursion is a choice, not an obligation.

elotar wrote:

Apd: It's unreasonable to assume that you will win with Minion tap in any serious competition.

I think it is unreasonable to make this claim.

Juggernaut1981 wrote:

Elotar,
You have kind of proved the opposite by listing at least 5 examples where decks including Minion Taps have one. Including one which would clearly appear to be a 'less likely' Tier 1 deck because it includes Malk Pranks.

There is 226 (not shure, I was counting pagedowns) decks in TWDA by the period. So it's 1/45 chanse. Smaller, then beting on zero in casino. Still possible thou.