Will Lilith´s Blessing return?

Azel wrote:

Honestly, you'd be better off with errata on "de facto banned" cards that already have had huge print runs. There's plenty of low tier cards that could use the elevation to playable status. And it'd be a far easier and far better use of the community's creativity than flaming out on some overpowered nonsense (especially hard-to-get promotional nonsense) that needed to be cut out of the card pool.

Like, go pick the master card Frenzy for "trifle" errata, or something. This is about as fruitful as asking for Edge Explosion to come back into the game. There's really *much* better things to do to improve this game.

We had a thread on masters that should be made trifles.

It was kinda fruitful, basically everyone agreed short term investment, long term investment, and secret horde should be trifles.

As for samedi and bloodlines, there are less broken ways to provide bloodgain. I want liliths to return, but even i hate it being a gain 3 free blood once a game enabler. Mandatory skill card, and it having 3 blood on it and depleting is optimal.
Samedi gain blood from little mountain, but should have some kind of engling fury hunt action where mayne they remove an ally from thier ashheap from the game to hunt for 2 and untap.

Anyway, i agree that any cards that could be erratad to be playable (meaning shitty cards and banned cards)
Would help the game. Yes, itd be cooler if pod was happening and we could buy new cards. But making several hundred cards in each collection playable would undeniably help some. I dont like printing and sleeving. I dig the new cards, but i feel like im proxying my sinkholes and a bayou in mtg again even thinking about it.
I get Hugh not umderstanding the fuss about liliths, as hes right about it being not screened right, and knows full well how rediculosly broken it is. But having more playable cards is optimal. What if we errata all Jyhad justicars that have inferior fortitude to having superior? Democritous, Angus become good. Sheldon becomes great.
There are cards we could make playable that currently arent. While fixing memories of motlrtality to say non imbued, or reissuing pto or lb arent high on the agenda, maybe fixing bad cards could be?

It at least helps the game.

Azel wrote:

Honestly, you'd be better off with errata on "de facto banned" cards that already have had huge print runs. There's plenty of low tier cards that could use the elevation to playable status. And it'd be a far easier and far better use of the community's creativity than flaming out on some overpowered nonsense (especially hard-to-get promotional nonsense) that needed to be cut out of the card pool.

Please bear in mind that there are a non-trivial number of players who like to play with the cards they've got, with minimal errata. (Me, I don't mind errata at all - but I understand where they're coming from.) Even when the cards are extremely powerful, borderline broken, there are players who'd rather soldier on than rewrite them.

6/23 and 7/7 both had anguished players upset about another truck of errata, even though they could (as some players did) print out sticky labels and put them in sleeves.


Personally, I think I would prefer enabling tech that made (some) crappy cards less crappy. Like a vampire with a special ability, an Event that made them usable, a political action that changed the ground rules of the game a little, or whatever. Multi-functional things that aren't bad anyway - say, a Kaymakli Fragment-like card that has a solid normal use, and also says "Regaining the Upper Hand is not poo anymore." Clearly, there's a need to exercise some moderation - you don't want every vampire crammed with specials that say "Pere Lachaise and the Deadliest Sin are now playable". And some cards are probably too corner case and situational to rehabilitate anyhow.

Lilith's Blessing was never as powerful as Villein. Everyone says: Villein should exist beacuse it's an 'enabler' for large-caps (and i agree in large part), but it's the combination of the two (MMPS!!!) that led to LB being banned. Which is kind of counter-intuitive since Villein gives you the real deal - pool - directly when Lilith's only gives your amptied vampires a one-time refill. Like 80% of the time, they will lose the blood again soon enough.

About LB not being an 'enabler':
Please tell that to my my poor vermin channel-bleed deck which became obsolete the instant LB was banned. surely, this cannot have been intentionally! MMPA is the one thing in VTES that is really unbalanced (Anson, Nana, Cybele, Parthenon above all & Parthenon and Isanwayen less). making any additional Master Phase Acions cost 1 through some means (as per Huitzilopochtli's special) could solve that, but that is another discussion. Ashur, Villein, LB, Liquidation, Golconda-recycling with Anthelios, even Giant's Blood: they only become insane once MMPA enters the picture. Saying Lilith's is the real problem is just not very correct in light of this.


As for Lilith's, making the skill-card mandatory as a fix gets my vote. (BTW, Hunting grounds have lost their value in most of my decks a long time ago and are no longer a good point of reference IMO. Just compare the newer 'Code of Samiel' from HttB to an oldskool regular Hunting ground and see what i mean. nice design, still not broken.)

On mmpas:

These decks are still broken.

Ruling you can only recieve an additional master phase from one source a turn, and making trifles not use up that source is optimal. Nana, Anson, Cybele are then still playable. As isxparthenon. But if yiu arent playing broken combo decks, why the hell do you need 3-4 freaking master phases?

Next on the list of fixes for girls decks are:

Erratta/ ban ashurs and liquidation(make ashurs say minion, liquidation once a game)
Ban villein. Or make it so a minion with a villein cant gain blood until the next minion phase.
Change Aksynia to remove a master card in your hand from the game.

Please note, we have already banned the easiest card to ban and these decks are still winning.

As has been stated, only tier 2, playable but not unstoppable types of decks are missing lilliths.

Errataing stuff is still a good idea, but eyes of the dead is probably a lost cause.........

I think we would've seen quite a bit of card text changes if the PoD had gone through.

Now with no chance of getting an actual printed version of a card with revised card text, I don't think revising cardtexts will rank that high on anyone's priorities.

It is amusing how one aspect can be discussed over and over again with exactly the same arguments. No offence meant, it's just remarkable.