New set of starters ideas

I would do the following:
6 pack boxes: 5 decks + 1 box with counters for everybody ( 200 would be enough).

That way, a group of friends could start the game out of the box.
They could even market it "a game of intrigue for 4 or 5 players".

Brum wrote:

I would do the following:
6 pack boxes: 5 decks + 1 box with counters for everybody ( 200 would be enough).

That way, a group of friends could start the game out of the box.
They could even market it "a game of intrigue for 4 or 5 players".

That was the idea behind the box set the Design Team developed for OneBookShelf. 5 clan-themed starters, a pile of counters, an edge marker, and a rulebook. It was proposed that the tray inside the box have extra slots for more decks, as additional decks were a Kickstarter stretch goal possibility.

It does lead to a "real word" design issue, where you need to balance the desire for high-quality counters with the cost of the components and the increased shipping costs due to weight. It does get one wondering what the end product really is - are they buying a game or are they buying a box full of beads?

That leads to questions about what present-day customer expectations are. V:TES has had a long Do-It-Yourself tradition. The original Jyhad/V:TES didn't come with counters or edge markers, nor did Wizards even offer them as products. The expectation was that you'd use pennies or whichever other counters you were already using for Magic: the Gathering or other games. Edge markers were just whatever game piece or knick-knack you happened to have. It wasn't until White Wolf re-launched the game that official Edge markers and counters were offered as part of prize support, but they weren't a main retail product. I've personally loved the DIY tradition of V:TES, and it's been a lot of fun seeing all the various things people have used for counters and Edges over the years. However, present-day consumer expectations may call for a complete game in one box rather than doing everything piecemeal.

Cam Ed did boxes of 6 different starters (1 for each Camarilla clan), so numbers other than 4 have been done before. That worked fairly nicely as it allowed swapping in a new deck rather than just having different pemutations of the same set of decks.

drnlmza wrote:

Cam Ed did boxes of 6 different starters (1 for each Camarilla clan), so numbers other than 4 have been done before. That worked fairly nicely as it allowed swapping in a new deck rather than just having different pemutations of the same set of decks.

That ended up being awful for retailers, as certain decks would be purchased in favor of others, leaving some decks behind and causing a serious disincentive for restocking. That's presumably true even for 4-different-starter display boxes, but it's exacerbated with 6 starters. Sure, one can try to design starters that are all equally worth purchasing, but also gets increasingly difficult the more starters you try to design.

An advantage of putting all the starters into a complete game boxed set is that the customer buys the whole set, leaving nothing behind. The disadvantages, of course, imclude the higher entry cost to try out the game, plus decreased flexibility in purchasing options.

BenPeal wrote:

Sure, one can try to design starters that are all equally worth purchasing, but also gets increasingly difficult the more starters you try to design.

I posted a release strategy in this topic that might work out well. Main point being, Sabbat/Camarilla theme startes are traded in for ... well starter kits you annually revise, but not alter (much). And then go nuts with theme sets (bloodlines, indies, anarchs, blackhand and new themes). I especially like the complexity scale from the topic. Please let me know what you think

BenPeal wrote:

An advantage of putting all the starters into a complete game boxed set is that the customer buys the whole set, leaving nothing behind. The disadvantages, of course, imclude the higher entry cost to try out the game, plus decreased flexibility in purchasing options.

Competition with other boxed games, seems daunting tbh. I'm afraid sales will probably be ok at first, then after a while marginal at best.

50 for a box with everything you and 4 other friends need to start to play doesn't seem unreasonable.
Sorry for stealing the idea, Ben. I knew I had seen it somewhere.

About the counters, edges, etc., I'm a big fan of things you can get only in tournaments.