On Villein. 1. "problematic card"

This discussions becomes really boring. Everybody are repeting the same arguments over and over again. It's my last time.

CONTRA
- Generally too powerful for a trifle
- Ridiculously powerful in combination with several effects
- Non available "basic" card

If you get rid of Villein, what will happen is that Parthenon, Nana, Cybele and Anson will see more play than they already do and idiotic poolgain will just be restricted to MMPA-decks again.

I strongly believe having a trifle take blood off a vampire is a very much needed effect. If Villein wouldn't exist, 90% of the masters in my collection wouldn´t see play. Not because the cards are bad, but simply because I *HAVE* to devote half my MPA's to Minion Tap.

I mean, I'd love to see it take a maximum of 5 blood (and have suggested exactly that the day the KoT spoilerlist was released), but that would mean rewording the card which is a bad idea without opportunity to reprint it. It should also SET the cost for Minion Tap to 1 instead of being cumulative, but that ship sailed a long time ago.

That said, the vast majority of Villeins are done for 3-6 blood and those are not a problem. The problem is people taking off everything and then instantly refilling it through either Lilith's Blessing or the Giant's Blood lottery.

The easiest fix is this:
1) Ban both Giant's Blood and Lilith's Blessing.
2) Undo the idiotic ruling that makes you able to play Villein for less than 2.

There, no more free vampires.

In my opinion, the first question regarding Villein is:
What do you want the card to be/should do?

If it should provide poolgain as a trifle that does not immediately trigger Lilith's Blessing, it would be enough to say: You can take all but one (or two) blood from the vampire to your pool.
(I believe this to be better than "take up to five blood", because then it would be the Up-to-5-Cap-Booster if combined with Lilith's Blessing ...)

Thus, playing Minion Tap would be interesting again, because with (the non-trifle) Minion Tap you COULD (ab)use Lilith's Blessing, IF you have a second master phase ... (and THEN the -1 penalty provided by Villein against Minion Tap would be sensitive ... and so on ...)

I agree with rewording a card without reprinting it is a problem, but I would -- if necessary at all -- highly prefer rewording in comparison with banning.

Banning a card should be the very last option ...

johannes wrote:

I think Villein, Giant´s Blood and Lilith´s Blessing belong in the same thread. Separating them is like asking "Are you against guns or against ammo"?

IF there is a problem, there is only a COMMON solution.

Okay, what do you suggest IF there was a problem? I think the other cards are fine, if Villein is nerfed. You might say Villein is fine if the other cards are nerfed. In my opinion it is most ugly to alter cards. So change just one card, Villein, would let two others unchanged. And vice versa. What do you think is the better way and why?

@Hakuron:
regarding Villein: You can take all but one (or two) blood from the vampire to your pool. great solution IMHO. and non-cumulative minion tap-hosing and we're done as far as i'm concerned.



@Izaak:
I wouldn't ban giant's blood, it's been around for too long. it was always intended as a lottery (equal chances for eveybody). lilith's blesing should be unique IMO instead of banned. see above.
I totally agree with your point of view regarding:
2) Undo the idiotic ruling that makes you able to play Villein for less than 2.