file TWD - Belgian NC 2018, Brussels (Belgium) (14. Jul. 2018)

19 Jul 2018 09:10 #89017 by Lech
@elotar: yes, exactly this. For example cel can get combat card :cel: strike:Dodge. :CEL: usable after strikes are chosen, your strike is also dodge (in addition to other strike types). Bam, grapple hose, aggro poke hose, perfect for acting vampires.
@cordovader: currently cel don't have power cards in and outside combat. It's neither most efficient at setting up range, survival after enemy strikes. It's acting as force multiplier and 44 is fixing its lack of payload, hitback(close range celerity is vulnerable to grapple, poke and is losing blood left and right).. 44 is permanent that is easy to set up and cheap (it earn its cost back during first strike).

:laso: :CEL: :DOM: :OBT: :POT: :cap8:
Sabbat.Black Hand Shakar: Lech loathe ranged weapons. Once each action, he may burn 1 blood to become Camarilla Prince of Krakow until the end of the action.

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19 Jul 2018 10:09 #89024 by elotar

@elotar: yes, exactly this. For example cel can get combat card :cel: strike:Dodge. :CEL: usable after strikes are chosen, your strike is also dodge (in addition to other strike types). Bam, grapple hose, aggro poke hose, perfect for acting vampires.


No it can't - there was Stutter-Step which can't be used with guns but still explicably worded "Only usable if both strike: hand strike and strike: dodges could be chosen". So such effect was deemed not fitting for the discipline.

... 44 is permanent that is easy to set up and cheap (it earn its cost back during first strike).


I think you should try to play with cel-guns. It's much more complicated to execute than any other combat strategy. You are balancing on the ropes whole game - at the beginning you are struggling to get CW+.44, then spare copies start to clog your hand, if you'll be outmaneuvered than close range combat kills you ets.

Can I ask you, why you are not complaining about really broken combat stuff like Deep Song + Carrion Crows + Aid from bats?

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19 Jul 2018 10:41 #89028 by Lech
So what that there is stutter-step? Can't better cards be printed for a discipline because there is some wallpaper card already?
I played some cel guns and after it gets its engine running, it's more efficient that most short chain combos with exception of aids from bats. Sure, in ideal world aids should provide just press to end, but we are talking about cel guns here, not about grapple and aids+carrions. Ideally, single discipline combat shouldn't be the way to go, but sadly it is the case.

Sure, in cel guns you have to get rid of useless stuff using infernal pursuit, but ashur tablets and two master phases make up for this. Same can be said about Nana.

:laso: :CEL: :DOM: :OBT: :POT: :cap8:
Sabbat.Black Hand Shakar: Lech loathe ranged weapons. Once each action, he may burn 1 blood to become Camarilla Prince of Krakow until the end of the action.

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19 Jul 2018 11:02 #89031 by elotar

I played some cel guns and after it gets its engine running, it's more efficient that most short chain combos with exception of aids from bats.


You obviously should be more effective - it's the only reason to bother with setup and pool cost.

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19 Jul 2018 11:53 #89033 by Lech
But why aren't melee weapons more effective? They also require setup yet don't provide desired combat chain. 44 give you maneuver and ability to use it on both ranges, melee only work at close, and don't provide maneuver, don't help against hit. No other gun is even close to this efficiency, so it's normal to expect some nerfs/bans. The risk/reward ratio is flawed here and the maneuver is not even thematic here(especially maneuver to close.. yeah).
Problem is deeper and boils down to lack of 0.5 damage which would help balancing out the game (but it can't be fixed with ease now).

:laso: :CEL: :DOM: :OBT: :POT: :cap8:
Sabbat.Black Hand Shakar: Lech loathe ranged weapons. Once each action, he may burn 1 blood to become Camarilla Prince of Krakow until the end of the action.

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19 Jul 2018 12:29 #89035 by elotar
Melee weapons are not effective because of IG.

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