Re: "Set the range"

Klaital wrote:

There are also some exceptions, like for example, if an Asanbonsam Ghoul blocks a d action, the range is set to close even before the combat starts so acting methuselah cannot set range.

So what happens if an Asanbonsam Ghoul blocks a D action that had been played with Squirrel Balance at [cel] or Neutral Guard at [obe]?

Mael wrote:

Klaital wrote:

There are also some exceptions, like for example, if an Asanbonsam Ghoul blocks a d action, the range is set to close even before the combat starts so acting methuselah cannot set range.

So what happens if an Asanbonsam Ghoul blocks a D action that had been played with Squirrel Balance at [cel] or Neutral Guard at [obe]?

I have no idea since they all use similar wording.

Mael wrote:

Klaital wrote:

There are also some exceptions, like for example, if an Asanbonsam Ghoul blocks a d action, the range is set to close even before the combat starts so acting methuselah cannot set range.

So what happens if an Asanbonsam Ghoul blocks a D action that had been played with Squirrel Balance at [cel] or Neutral Guard at [obe]?

I'm interested in that also.

"Once set, the range cannot be changed."
I can see many different views. So does Neutral Guard set the range outside combat instantly when you play it. Asanbonsam Ghoul sets the range after successfully block which is right before combat and Neutral Guard says "when this vampire is in combat, the range is automatically long".

I would say Asanbosam Ghoul wins Neutral Guard b/c range sets happens first: after successfully block. Neutral Guard says "when this vampire is in combat". But it is whole different situation with Squirrel Balance . Squirrel Balance and Asanbonsam Ghoul happens same time.

I really don't understand why VTES has to use so many different wordings. All those cards could have been changed to use wording "before range is determined, set the range".

Mael wrote:

So what happens if an Asanbonsam Ghoul blocks a D action that had been played with Squirrel Balance at [cel] or Neutral Guard at [obe]?

The first effect to kick in wins. (And can prevent later ones being played.)

[LSJ 20080215]

LSJ wrote:

> What about an acting minion playing Squirrel Balance at cel, and the
> reacting minion playing Internal Recursion at tem.

SB sets the range to long.

> What about the same reacting minion from before, and the acting minion
> wants to play Selective Silence.

IR sets the range when played.

> Just trying to figure out range-setting.

Once set, it cannot be re-set.

The third answer from LSJ implies that in the first case, if you've played Squirrel Balance, you can't play Internal Recursion.

Neutral Guard would similarly trump Internal Recursion.

Both NG and SB should trump Asanbonsam.

Surreal wrote:

I really don't understand why VTES has to use so many different wordings. All those cards could have been changed to use wording "before range is determined, set the range".

They'd work differently.

Asanbonsam kicks in at block, and so trumps (for example) an acting minion who wants to play Shadow Step. In a situation where two effects were both just going off before range, the acting Methuselah would have the impulse and could order their effect first. With the current wording, some effects don't go off at the same time, so the impact of the impulse is different.

jamesatzephyr wrote:

Mael wrote:

So what happens if an Asanbonsam Ghoul blocks a D action that had been played with Squirrel Balance at [cel] or Neutral Guard at [obe]?

The first effect to kick in wins. (And can prevent later ones being played.)

[LSJ 20080215]

LSJ wrote:

> What about an acting minion playing Squirrel Balance at cel, and the
> reacting minion playing Internal Recursion at tem.

SB sets the range to long.

> What about the same reacting minion from before, and the acting minion
> wants to play Selective Silence.

IR sets the range when played.

> Just trying to figure out range-setting.

Once set, it cannot be re-set.

The third answer from LSJ implies that in the first case, if you've played Squirrel Balance, you can't play Internal Recursion.

Neutral Guard would similarly trump Internal Recursion.

Both NG and SB should trump Asanbonsam.

Correct.
Regarding the Asanbonsam: If the acting minion plays Squirrel Balance or Neutral Guard, and Asanbonsam successfully blocks, the first round of combat is at close range.