file Imbued and blood costs/general mechanics

01 Nov 2015 15:07 #73992 by 2wayspeaker
www.vekn.net/rulebook/appendix-imbued-rules
I'll take all links to other imbued rules compendiums as well so I can get a general better understanding. I'll probably design a graphic rules sheet for imbued because our playgroup doesn't allow them without clear and comprehensive "What the hell is he doing" guide for the table.


Question - Can an imbued use Codex to bleed for 4?
I was thinking about an imbued deck, I don't really know how they work.
Since Imbued are allies and are the ideal users of Flash Grenade I figured why not use the fact that my prey is tapped out to play Codex of the edenic groundskeepers. But then the card text makes me hesitates, as the Codex costs 1 blood. However in instances like Theft of Vitae Blood = Life so there's precedence.

Codex of the Edenic Groundskeepers
Equipment
[1 Pool]
Unique equipment.
This minion gets -2 stealth when bleeding. This minion may bleed as a (D) action that costs 1 blood; this action gets +3 bleed if the target Methuselah doesn't control a ready untapped minion.

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01 Nov 2015 15:15 #73993 by glaswanderer
No. Imbued have life not blood, so they cannot pay the 1 blood to activate the Codex.

Prince of Puyallup

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01 Nov 2015 15:23 - 01 Nov 2015 15:36 #73994 by 2wayspeaker
Okay, but why?

What makes theft work and codex not work?

Theft of Vitae
Combat
Thaumaturgy
[tha] Strike: ranged. Steal 1 blood.
[THA] Strike: ranged. Steal 2 blood.


Edit:
There's also this relevant part of the rulebook:

1.6.3. Minion Cards

Minion cards are cards that your vampires and allies (collectively referred to as "minions") play. Unless the card states otherwise, a minion card is burned after a minion plays it.

By default, a minion card in play is controlled by the controller of the minion it is on. If a minion card is just in play and not on another controlled card, then it is, by default, controlled by the Methuselah who played it.

In many cases, a minion card will have a Discipline symbol, a clan symbol and/or a blood cost; in these cases, the card can only be played by a vampire who meets the requirements.

Some allies have the ability to play certain cards "as a vampire." In these cases, the ally is treated as a vampire for all effects generated by the play of the card, including duration effects (like "for the remainder of combat"). The ally's life represents his blood (to pay costs, for example). Any blood he gains or loses as a vampire equates to a gain or loss of life for the ally. For purposes of that card, the ally has a capacity of 1 by default (for use if the card requires an older vampire or a vampire of a given capacity). If the ally gains life in excess of his capacity, it doesn't drain off, and if the effect inflicts aggravated damage on the ally, he burns life as normal. However, if the effect would send the ally to torpor, then he is burned instead. The ally is treated as a vampire only for the effect generated from playing the card. In particular, the ally is not treated as a vampire for effects the card has from being in play (like "the vampire with this card" effects).

Codex of the Edenic Groundskeepers
Equipment
[1 Pool]
Unique equipment.
This minion gets -2 stealth when bleeding. This minion may bleed as a (D) action that costs 1 blood; this action gets +3 bleed if the target Methuselah doesn't control a ready untapped minion.

Last edit: 01 Nov 2015 15:36 by 2wayspeaker.

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01 Nov 2015 15:53 #73995 by Pascal Bertrand
[quote="Rulebook 6.4.5 - 'Steal Blood'"[/quote]Steal Blood. This effect moves blood counters (or life counters) from the target to the striking minion. [/quote]

Imbued cannot play cards (or use effects) that cost blood. They can steal blood (that transforms to life) or can get stolen life (if via strikes, that would be a "strike: steal blood" effect).

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01 Nov 2015 17:13 #73998 by 2wayspeaker
So what about Jennifer's card text:

Jennifer Flame61 Vidisania
[ven][vis]
[Avenger]
Capacity: 4
Group: 4
Weapons cost Jennifer 1 less pool or blood. +1 bleed. -1 stealth.


(There's currently no Weapons that cost blood)

Disregarding that; Why put it in her special that weapons cost 1 less blood if she, according to you, can't pay in blood anyway?

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01 Nov 2015 17:18 #73999 by Ankha

So what about Jennifer's card text:

Jennifer Flame61 Vidisania
[ven][vis]
[Avenger]
Capacity: 4
Group: 4
Weapons cost Jennifer 1 less pool or blood. +1 bleed. -1 stealth.


(There's currently no Weapons that cost blood)

Disregarding that; Why put it in her special that weapons cost 1 less blood if she, according to you, can't pay in blood anyway?

She could equip with a weapon that costs 1 blood, because then she would have to pay 0 blood, making it a legal move.

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director

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