question-circle Wake + timing effects

27 Oct 2023 21:07 - 14 Feb 2024 16:32 #109672 by Charles_Bronson
Here we go.

I know we have a window to play wake effects to cancel cards "as played". From:

"As played" (a phrase used by many card-canceling effects) comes after the card in question is fully announced and before the played card is replaced and before the effect the play generates. In general, no card or effect can be used in this window. The only ones that can be are the effects that say so, and Wake-style effects that enable such cards to be played ("may play reaction cards" effects, not "untap self" or other effects). [RTR]

So the first sequence is:

1. Tegyrius announce he is playing a Public Trust, and put the card in the table.
and he will play soon after it a deed's the heart desire on a blocking minion.

2. Blocking minion can play a wake effect to play a touch of clarity and cancel the public trust BEFORE the deed's the heart desire enters play.

3. Everyone then replace the 3 cards played.

So far so good.

The new spoiled card, UNLEASHING THE BESTIAL SOUL, says:
only usabe as the action is announced
[dom] choose a minion. the chosen minion cannot play reactions cards this action.
[DOM] as above, and the next reaction card played this action costs +1 blood or life.

So, the question is:

1. A new Salubri announces a bleed with govern. He has Unleashing the bestial soul in hand and will play it as soon as it is possible.

2. Can I play wake on my only tapped minion on the cancel as-played- window with no cancel cards in hand just to "cheat" the cannot play reactions effect from unleashing the bestial soul? and then block the action?

Or can I ONLY play wake effects on this window if I have a cancelling effect?

thanks!
Alexandre Costaa

I am death.
Paul Kersey, Death Wish
:vent::THA::QUI::FOR::dom::obf::cap9:
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Last edit: 14 Feb 2024 16:32 by Ankha.
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27 Oct 2023 22:15 - 27 Oct 2023 22:17 #109673 by Hobbesgoblin
Replied by Hobbesgoblin on topic Wake + timing effects

2. Can I play wake on my only tapped minion on the cancel as-played- window with no cancel cards in hand just to "cheat" the cannot play reactions effect from unleashing the bestial soul? and then block the action?


By the Ruleboook: I think Yes.
I don't know of any ruling against this.
Last edit: 27 Oct 2023 22:17 by Hobbesgoblin.
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27 Oct 2023 23:09 - 27 Oct 2023 23:18 #109674 by KoRneeshon
Replied by KoRneeshon on topic Wake + timing effects
Because of sequencing rules, you (acting minion) get to play as many effects as you want first (in the specified time window).

BTW, AFAIK there's no wake card that is playable during the "as a card is played" window - these cards are played later. So, if there's a reaction card that allows you to cancel another card as it is played, you cannot play any wakes before it to use it, as opportunity to play a wake shows up later, when the "as a card is played" window is already closed.
Last edit: 27 Oct 2023 23:18 by KoRneeshon.

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28 Oct 2023 07:02 - 28 Oct 2023 07:02 #109683 by Ankha
Replied by Ankha on topic Wake + timing effects

1. Tegyrius announce he is playing a Public Trust, and put the card in the table.
and he will play soon after it a deed's the heart desire on a blocking minion.

2. Blocking minion can play a wake effect to play a touch of clarity and cancel the public trust BEFORE the deed's the heart desire enters play.

Not a "blocking" minion, but a minion controlled by another Methuselah.

3. Everyone then replace the 3 cards played.

The Public Trust, the wake, and the Touch of Clarity, correct.

The new spoiled card, UNLEASHING THE BESTIAL SOUL, says:
only usabe as the action is announced
[dom] choose a minion. the chosen minion cannot play reactions cards this action.
[DOM] as above, and the next reaction card played this action costs +1 blood or life.

So, the question is:

1. A new Salubri announces a bleed with govern. He has Unleashing the bestial soul in hand and will play it as soon as it is possible.

2. Can I play wake on my only tapped minion on the cancel as-played- window with no cancel cards in hand just to "cheat" the cannot play reactions effect from unleashing the bestial soul? and then block the action?

Sure.

Or can I ONLY play wake effects on this window if I have a cancelling effect?

No.

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
Last edit: 28 Oct 2023 07:02 by Ankha.
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28 Oct 2023 07:03 #109684 by Ankha
Replied by Ankha on topic Wake + timing effects

BTW, AFAIK there's no wake card that is playable during the "as a card is played" window - these cards are played later. So, if there's a reaction card that allows you to cancel another card as it is played, you cannot play any wakes before it to use it, as opportunity to play a wake shows up later, when the "as a card is played" window is already closed.


Wrong, see rulebook:

"ADVANCED RULES

Some effects can cancel a card “as it is played.” These effects, as well as wake effects, are the only effects allowed during the “as played” time period of another card. Even drawing to replace cards, comes after this time period."

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
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28 Oct 2023 07:08 #109685 by Hobbesgoblin
Replied by Hobbesgoblin on topic Wake + timing effects
Thank for the clarification

Please consider changing that, as it seems as it would massivly undermine "can't play reaction cards" effects, that you can play wakes as a reaction to "as played" to such an effect, like Psalm of the damned or Unleash the bestial soul.

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