New set in 2012

Amenophobis wrote:

Angel74 wrote:

Thanks for clarifying. But I have my doubts about that last part of your post. I have read some pretty concerning things on the forum about the VEKN and how it's seen by some.

I'll just say that I hope you're right.

Good advice CAN come from debating things, even if said debate gets somewhat heated at some point. I'd like to think that's what a forum is for. If no desire for debate, then why run a forum under the VEKN flag?

See, here lies the problem.

There would be no open forum for open discussion, if the VEKN was some kind of elitist club. Which it isn't. Yes, I'm biased, as I'm NC, but I have been involved with the VEKN for about 14-15 years and I have never had the feeling that the powers that be are not willing to listen to good arguments.

Well, then the problem might even be non-existent. I already was under the impression that we could all give our opinions, sometimes that even leading to a change in rules or policy.

Until I read some posts in which folks seemingly pretended they were actually more 'elite' than others, or other posting statements that got me doubting the openness of the VEKN. Suddenly we were 'defying the will of the VEKN, who were running the game', and 'arguing for nothing', while I was under the impression we were debating the implementation of the new set.

What you just posted sounds a lot more sensible to me, so thanks for that.

What I cannot understand is that there are people who are not involved with the VEKN who judge the book by it's cover. You can always talk to the people who run the VEKN. Send them a message with the menu on the left side of this website.

Books will always be judged by their covers at first, but it's very good to get reassured in the fact the VEKN still has an open mind.

If you have strong feelings about VTES and the player base, why not try to improve things from within (there can always be room for improvement)?

Believe me, from where we are, we're already trying this. Dutch V:tES scene is still going strong; just not expanding as much as we would like. Dutch forum is active, and tournaments are still visited by many (for Dutch standards, that is).

It's just becoming harder and harder promoting a game that's out of print, so I too see the urge for a restart, and can only hope it will come (with whatever help and/or influence the VEKN can contribute to it).

The VEKN does not "run" VTES. The owner is still WW/CCP. The VEKN is trying to ensure that the playerbase remains at a healthy level and provides a fair playing field for all players participating in tournaments. Everything the VEKN does, is not for itself, but for the players out there.

Good, that's what I like to read. I hope some others will read this too...

What players do in their friendly, private games, is entirely up to them: cardlimits, deck-type-shunning, proxies on paper, proxies on cardboard, etc. Just don't ask the VEKN to condone things which they know would be detrimental to the goals of the VEKN.

Fair enough. I already said - if the policy on the new set remains unchanged, I will never try to willingly go against the rules when I attend a VEKN event, and keep things like the carboard prints within our private games.

Kepp on playing. B)

Will do. Just a few hours ago I won a game with an Imbued deck - first time that worked out for me.

Izaak wrote:

If you want to be an ass about it and DQ the three guys that drove 300 miles to your tournament because they printed their new cards on 220g cardboard and cut some nice round corners instead of sticking 80 gram papers with an original card, feel free to do so.

I like how you made the false choice there, instead of pointing out that if the players in question knew enough to use 220g cardboard then they knew very well that they were breaking the tournament rules set up by the VEKN.

Kevin is correct! Rules are rules and you have to follow them, even if you don't want to or think you know better.

captain1arm wrote:

Kevin is correct! Rules are rules and you have to follow them, even if you don't want to or think you know better.

Or you make a tournament/league without VEKN sanction and don't bother with PDF sets.

Cyrus wrote:

captain1arm wrote:

Kevin is correct! Rules are rules and you have to follow them, even if you don't want to or think you know better.

Or you make a tournament/league without VEKN sanction and don't bother with PDF sets.

Or you can have an unsanctioned tournament with every fan made card that's ever been suggested anywhere on the internet if you want to use your card making skills.

Izaak wrote:

The onus is on VEKN to explain why silly rules are being added (and, likely enforced on NAC/EC level).

They did, and you didn't like it. Johannes Walches (and any other people legally responsible for VEKN) don't like the idea of havin Hasbro + CCP arriving at their place to sue them for their life-savings and anything else the lawyers can get hold of. I don't get to choose for Johannes et al. I perfectly understand that they, from whatever advice they have, believe they have approximately two choices:

1) Create a rule that obviously encourages cards that are NOT of 'professional quality suitable for sale' like those formerly printed by WW. This way, they are SURE no lawyers come knocking looking to sue people.

2) Create a rule that clearly lets print 'proxy' quality cards, that may not be easily defined as anything other than a counterfeit card, which are 600+ dpi on double-glued-pressed and die cut cards. This way, Johannes et al may be liable for encouraging others to breach copyright and 'rob' Hasbro/CCP of their 'rightful' profits by encouraging counterfeiting and get happy lawyers handing over summonses for court cases.


If Johannes et al want to choose the safer option, that makes sure they keep their businesses, homes and assets... I have to say, it sounds very responsible and caring of their families.