obf dom ghoul

@suoli : Yep, but I have only 1 jake washington and never expecteed to have more^^. If I had more the deck would be :
+3 jake
-1 procuror
-1 asanbonsam
-1 political ally ( last option because i love this ally)


@Ylly : have access to 1 card, wich gives you +1 stealth with blood cost 1 does not give you acces to stealth. In order to bleed at 3 with tzim you must play 2 cards at 2 different disciplines when contioning offers you +3 bleed in 1 card. I have a different vision : give obf dom minions access to war ghouls^^.



@ohlmann :
This deck is not a speed war ghoul or speed shambling. It is a obf dom deck, which does not pay his vamps because of villein + LB combo and which defends his vamps with combat allies. I see you have not say anything constructive since the beginning of this discussion. And your arguments only point problems of the deck 1 by 1 without considering the entire deck or a table global situation.

For instance, you say that a rush deck will explode my minions before I can recruit anything. I can wait and buy 3 vamp at the same time and/or play jake washington and recruit ossian or carlton in 1 turn. furthermore, a rush deck will explode in my first full powered bleed turn. Finally we both know that v:tes is not a 1 vs 1 game.

At the end of the day, I do not post here the future tier 1 deck. I am just trying to build a deck able to make a game win.

I am just looking for some advice.

imho war ghoul is good, but not so good to jeoardize with the stability. try it out and you will see. i tried 4 discipline or 5 clan decks. if you draw like a demigod, those decks rock. if not, you cry all the time...
and btw, bleeding with 2 minions for 3 and rushing with one seems inferior to rushing with 1-2 and bleeding with 2 for 3-6 (shambling giovanni )
you claimed it was a dom/obf deck with ghouls, but due to the ghouls, even the dom/obf mechanism becomes corrupted. ghouls require too much to be efficient with basically nonTzim deck... that is what i think

i tried 4 discipline or 5 clan decks. if you draw like a demigod, those decks rock. if not, you cry all the time...

I beg to disagree, weenies are 5+ clan decks and they do their job. 5 discipline decks are viable as well, if you choose your crypt wisely and make sure that each discipline is specialized. E.g., you can have a star vampire with all 5 disciplines and support with any combination of 4 (like including PRE for voting and DOM for bouncing). If you have rush as prey, you can choose a minion with no DOM as secondary, if you have heavy voter as prey/predator, you leave out minion with PRE. An example could be Hardestadt deck with POT-cel-FOR combat package, DOM bounce and PRE vote. Support would be Gustav Brendenstein (all 5 disciplines, inf pot+cel), and Jann Berger (no dom). Take first one for support if combat is light, second if combat is tight. First way you'd have ability to tap for 5 more votes, second way you would have cheapened Pot cards and +1 bleed. Either way you would have 6 votes on the table.

I see you have not say anything constructive since the beginning of this discussion.

... and still you put 4 card requiring Tzimisce with 4 tzimisces in the crypt. And still no Wider View. And a lot of other retainer make no sense without the war ghoul. What do you do without Tzimisce in the initial crypt ? If you believe that pointing out the hole in the concept is not constructive, then not much can be constructive.

And it's not like the S&B angle is impressive. 10 bleed card, 9 stealth card (for bleed), no responsible bleeding at all. It's not enough to do something if the war ghoul angle fail - which it will often, given you have few tzimisce and few way to improve the situation if something happen to one thoses.

The concept does not work because you try to graft 2 disciplines to another clan with midcap. Predictably, there is almost no vampire with thoses disciplines, and they are big for their size.

Ylly wrote:

you claimed it was a dom/obf deck with ghouls, but due to the ghouls, even the dom/obf mechanism becomes corrupted. ghouls require too much to be efficient with basically nonTzim deck... that is what i think

I agree. The deck is a weak bleeder, a weak rusher, and a weak wall, because it try to put together thing that have not much in common.

If you were using, say, Bima, instead of warghoul, thing would work, because even if bima aren't as strong as war ghoul, they need less setup, can help the bleed effort, and most importantly there is a decent obf/dom FoS crypt.

Ditto if you were using Shadow Court Satyr or Nephandus. Maybe even Muddled Vampire Hunter with Old School malkavian. There is no shortage of ally easy to recruit that can protect vampire, so taking one which is hard to put into play and expensive may not be all that smart.