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- [Submission] Wheel of Fortune (vote reveals hands and discard master cards)
[Submission] Wheel of Fortune (vote reveals hands and discard master cards)
14 Aug 2013 08:54 #53125
by Pascal Bertrand
Replied by Pascal Bertrand on topic Re: [Submission] Wheel of Fortune (vote reveals hands and discard master cards)
I suppose it refers to MtG's Wheel of Fortune, where everyone would discard their hqnd and redraw a full handsize (afair, the card is banned)I don't get the name
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14 Aug 2013 09:16 #53126
by Ankha
Replied by Ankha on topic Re: [Submission] Wheel of Fortune (vote reveals hands and discard master cards)
Comparing it to KRC is a bit a nonsense. If you want to deal damage, play KRC, Conservative or Ancilla.
If you want to see the hand of any Methuselah and discard all master cards of it (while dealing some damage), play this card.
I would probably add 1 or 2 copies of it in vote decks with not a lot of masters (in case it backfires).
As for the name: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rota_Fortunae
If you want to see the hand of any Methuselah and discard all master cards of it (while dealing some damage), play this card.
I would probably add 1 or 2 copies of it in vote decks with not a lot of masters (in case it backfires).
As for the name: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rota_Fortunae
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14 Aug 2013 09:32 - 14 Aug 2013 09:32 #53127
by Ohlmann
Replied by Ohlmann on topic Re: [Submission] Wheel of Fortune (vote reveals hands and discard master cards)
It's not a nonsense, because a dead player won't cause you trouble with his master. Also, both seeing the hand of a player and discarding card in it are reasonably minor effect - that's why you added damage on top of that I suppose - so I am unsure whether it make sense even against master-heavy deck. Still, it's would be worth trying it I think.
Maybe make discarded card not replaced before the end of the master phase, so it have more consequence to master-heavy deck ? One of the problem of the card right now is that the discard may very well not affect them at all, because they can replace discarded master with new drawn master, and/or retrive the important master via Anthelios if they draw an unadapted one. It would also prevent them from using Anthelios this turn.
Maybe make discarded card not replaced before the end of the master phase, so it have more consequence to master-heavy deck ? One of the problem of the card right now is that the discard may very well not affect them at all, because they can replace discarded master with new drawn master, and/or retrive the important master via Anthelios if they draw an unadapted one. It would also prevent them from using Anthelios this turn.
Last edit: 14 Aug 2013 09:32 by Ohlmann.
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14 Aug 2013 11:38 - 14 Aug 2013 11:46 #53133
by jamesatzephyr
It's not nonsense, because you have to gauge the hidden cost of the card. I could be playing KRC instead. Since I'm not, what drawbacks am I getting? Do the benefits outweigh those? Since it's quite a variable card, am I comfortable with (plucking numbers out of thin air) getting a poor card 90% of the time and an awesome card 10% of the time? (Say, Kindred Segregation could be an amazingly solid vote if everyone consistently had lots of costly library allies. But they don't.)
If the card strays too far from admittedly-fungible 'acceptable' parameters, it won't see solid play. It might see play as a prayer card (that one copy of Peace Treaty you include to piss off the .44 Magnum player). It won't be in a deck 4, 6, 8 times, and won't cause a significant shift in master card decks, because few people play it. Because they're just playing KRC or Parity Shift instead.
Replied by jamesatzephyr on topic Re: [Submission] Wheel of Fortune (vote reveals hands and discard master cards)
Comparing it to KRC is a bit a nonsense. If you want to deal damage, play KRC, Conservative or Ancilla.
It's not nonsense, because you have to gauge the hidden cost of the card. I could be playing KRC instead. Since I'm not, what drawbacks am I getting? Do the benefits outweigh those? Since it's quite a variable card, am I comfortable with (plucking numbers out of thin air) getting a poor card 90% of the time and an awesome card 10% of the time? (Say, Kindred Segregation could be an amazingly solid vote if everyone consistently had lots of costly library allies. But they don't.)
If the card strays too far from admittedly-fungible 'acceptable' parameters, it won't see solid play. It might see play as a prayer card (that one copy of Peace Treaty you include to piss off the .44 Magnum player). It won't be in a deck 4, 6, 8 times, and won't cause a significant shift in master card decks, because few people play it. Because they're just playing KRC or Parity Shift instead.
Last edit: 14 Aug 2013 11:46 by jamesatzephyr.
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14 Aug 2013 12:16 - 14 Aug 2013 12:17 #53135
by Timo
Replied by Timo on topic Re: [Submission] Wheel of Fortune
"Playing a Pentex on Una. It costs 2 pools.
The face on Una controler when he has to discard his own copy. It is priceless"
On the same level, playing it on your ravnos embrace predator who was carefully stacking his week of nightmare for the lunge (you can replace with pala grande).
The face on Una controler when he has to discard his own copy. It is priceless"
On the same level, playing it on your ravnos embrace predator who was carefully stacking his week of nightmare for the lunge (you can replace with pala grande).
Last edit: 14 Aug 2013 12:17 by Timo.
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14 Aug 2013 12:39 - 14 Aug 2013 12:39 #53138
by Ankha
Replied by Ankha on topic Re: [Submission] Wheel of Fortune (vote reveals hands and discard master cards)
The main interest of the card is too make sure that the chosen Methuselah will probably won't play any master card during his or her next turn (plus seeing his hand is nice). This goes well in a control deck (make sure your prey's plan is foiled by discarding a Sudden Reversal, a DI, a Haven Uncovered or Frontal Assault) or in an agressive deck (remove Blood Doll, Vessels and Villeins). You can even remove a Archon Investigation which is nice.
Additionally, there's some pool damage to keep the card interesting. Comparing the amount of pool damage has no sense imho, since it's variable and not the main interest (just like comparing the pool that a Banishment would cost to a player compared to a KRC).
This "why wouldn't I play KRC instead" argument is a bit fallacious to me. Vote cards are not necessarily meant to deal damage. I've never seen anyone ask "Why wouldn't I play a Govern the Unaligned instead of a Bum's Rush?".
Additionally, there's some pool damage to keep the card interesting. Comparing the amount of pool damage has no sense imho, since it's variable and not the main interest (just like comparing the pool that a Banishment would cost to a player compared to a KRC).
This "why wouldn't I play KRC instead" argument is a bit fallacious to me. Vote cards are not necessarily meant to deal damage. I've never seen anyone ask "Why wouldn't I play a Govern the Unaligned instead of a Bum's Rush?".
Last edit: 14 Aug 2013 12:39 by Ankha.
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