file How to make Potence better?

10 Aug 2018 23:24 #89893 by ICL
Replied by ICL on topic How to make Potence better?
Celerity used to be similarly limited. Fortitude, meanwhile, got Freak Drive and evasion.

Celerity has since gotten Resist Earth's Grasp. Celerity has more ways to unlock or not lock. Torrent seems kind of underplayed. But, mostly, Celerity got REG and that's been a major change.

Don't keep pushing Potence combat if you want Potence to be a better discipline. Give it useful things to do/stop.

Anything can be pretty easily justified with the right thematic explanation, but it doesn't seem a stretch to me to give Potence "Do not lock ..." because Potence just pushes past any obstacles. Potence can easily gain stealth because breaking locks doesn't always require making a bunch of noise (see superstrength used by supers in civilian guise). Strength can wreck equipment outside of combat. Strength can make hunting easier. Etc.

The Rough Way
C = 0
Hunt Action
<pot>: Do not lock to perform this action.
<POT>: As above, Hunt +1.

Skills of the Superman
Action Modifier
C = 1
<pot>: +1 Stealth. If this action is blocked, gain a maneuver or press in the resulting combat.
<POT>: Allies and vampires cannot block this action unless they burn 2 blood or 2 life.

Long Leap
C = 0
<pot>: Maneuver.
<POT>: +1 intercept. If combat occurs this action, this reacting vampire gains a maneuver.

Wrecking Ball
Action Modifier
C = 0
<pot>: Burn 1 blood for +1 bleed.
<POT>: +2 bleed.

Whatever. There are mechanics that are just better than other mechanics and it may seem banal to have everyone have access to the same things, but it's a game and there's still ways to do enough flavor. Not talking about making every Pot deck a stealth bleed deck, but look at what Deep Song does for Ani combat decks.

Why wouldn't Cel/Pot have + bleed given that you can quickly and efficiently mess with people's resources physically as opposed to doing similar things mentally (Chi, Dem, whatever)?
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11 Aug 2018 13:28 #89899 by ReverendRevolver
ICL has made good points on what kinds of things potence could have access to; being able to hit really hard has applications when getting from point A to point B with an obstacle in the way, and it also has applications stopping someone else from making it from point Ato point B:

Unstoppable Force
only usable when this vampire is being blocked.
:pot: Inflict 2 unpreventable damage on the blocking minion. If they are no longer ready, this action continues as if unblocked.
:POT: as above, but with +1 bleed.
[Optional third level]
:FOR: :POT: End the action and inflict 2 unpreventable damage on this acting vampire and 4 unpreventable damage on the blocking minion.

Immovable Object
Only usable by a blocking minion.
:pot: inflict 1 unpreventable damage on the acting minion.
:POT: inflict 2 unpreventable damage on the acting minion, and they cannot play cards requiring :chi: :dom: or :pre: this action.
:FOR: :POT: As above, and they cannot press the first round of the resulting combat.

The second one is more appropriate as part of the :for: ability in vtda guide to the high clans where your enemies cannot physically displace you, but potence being able to smack other minions around outside of combat or playing horseshoes means the non-red card potence would be playable.

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11 Aug 2018 16:10 #89902 by LivesByProxy

In combat still makes no sense: I bleed you , you bock, I play Collateral Damage and we fight in your Parthenon, you play Collateral Damage and we fight in my Warsaw Station. We fight in both places at the same time, yeah. This idea will not fly. The action version would target a minion in a location, effectively and use the basic mechanic you seek and make sense.

It would need to be limited to 1 per combat then. Prevents your opponent from playing one, and it also prevents you from playing three Collateral Damage in the same round for 6+ pool burn.

@ReverendRevolver: If we're going to have Unstoppable Force and Immovable Object, the two cards should be a mirror of each other. :P

@ICL: I find it very strange that Animalism has more +intercept than Celerity... But about you ideas, they're on the right track, I just think they should be more conditional. :P Something like:

:pot: (d) Bleed. This acting minion gets +1 bleed if your prey controls a location.
:POT: As above, and choose a location they control. Tap that location. It doesn't unlock during their next unlock step and that location's text box is considered blank until the end of their next turn.

:gang: :CEL: :FOR: :PRO: :cap6: Gangrel. Noddist. Camarilla. Once each turn, LivesByProxy may burn 1 blood to lose Protean :PRO: until the end of the turn and gain your choice of superior Auspex :AUS:, Obfuscate :OBF:, or Potence :POT: for the current action.

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11 Aug 2018 17:45 - 11 Aug 2018 17:46 #89905 by Lech
Replied by Lech on topic How to make Potence better?
You won't make potence better and more true to it's roots with giving it out-of-combat stuff. You'll make it just better, but it's not what i'd like to see. I'd rather make it even better in combat, and give it some non-action combat permanents.

I'm actually digging collateral damage idea that is one-per-combat (so enemy can't play his if you played yours.

Also, some fun modifier:

1 blood
Only usable as bleed is announced.
:pot: You may discard up to two :pot: ,:cel: and/or :for: cards to get +1 bleed for each.
:POT: As above, and your prey burn 1 pool if he control a location.

:laso: :CEL: :DOM: :OBT: :POT: :cap8:
Sabbat.Black Hand Shakar: Lech loathe ranged weapons. Once each action, he may burn 1 blood to become Camarilla Prince of Krakow until the end of the action.
Last edit: 11 Aug 2018 17:46 by Lech.

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